What do ya'll think about this?
#11
01-28-2009, 10:48 PM
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Doesn't care what people ride as long as they can keep up!
Doesn't care what people ride as long as they can keep up!
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What do ya'll think about this?
Oh lord, don't get me started..............................
This will mean nothing, the same as any other 'government' plan.
There is plenty of money that already goes to the trails, you just have to meet the criteria. With people like the Sierra Club and others like them, we will have a tough road ahead of us. The Dems all support the global warming thing also. That just shuts us down even more. We have to support our clubs and other organizations like the Blue Ribbon Coalition. I know some who are in this and working for us. The red tape is very thick and strands farther than we can see right now...................They are winning a few things lately though. Pretty good progress for the things they have to deal with.
Oh, I don't even want to get into it.
This will mean nothing, the same as any other 'government' plan.
There is plenty of money that already goes to the trails, you just have to meet the criteria. With people like the Sierra Club and others like them, we will have a tough road ahead of us. The Dems all support the global warming thing also. That just shuts us down even more. We have to support our clubs and other organizations like the Blue Ribbon Coalition. I know some who are in this and working for us. The red tape is very thick and strands farther than we can see right now...................They are winning a few things lately though. Pretty good progress for the things they have to deal with.
Oh, I don't even want to get into it.
#12
01-29-2009, 12:56 PM
Super Moderator
Well, golly JimBob!
Well, golly JimBob!
What do ya'll think about this?
I'd rather see a tax cut for people who are "paying" taxes, not for those who don't. Then it would be $1 spent for every dollar the taxpayer gets back. If the government gets a hold of that same dollar it will maybe end up with 20-30% back in the economy after the government gets done with paying the ever increasing bureaucracy. I read somewhere that almost 40% of the population either works for the government or is dependent on the government in some way. That's a dangerous place to be in. I have a sister in law who escaped Czecheslovokia when it was ruled by the Russians. She has a saying. "The government pretended to pay us and we pretended to work."
#13
01-29-2009, 08:46 PM
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What do ya'll think about this?
I don't think that you guy's understand....
Haven't you figured it out by now that the government is waaaaay smarter than we are and will be able to spend our money in a much better way and on better things than we can!
And oh yea, that 25 mil. that will be used to make "trails" ??
That will be challenged in court by an environmental group because the trail will threaten the habitat of a yellow throated sparrow or something and then the government will have to spend 8 or 10 mil. more to defend the legality of the trail ( down to one by now) and about 8 years later you will be able to PAY to ride on the "NEW" trail that is owned by a senators brother in law! And the 25-35 mil?....
That will be lining the pockets of the lawyers,insurance company's and politicians
that "Fought for or against the proposed "Trails"!
Oh and where does this trail lead?...................
SOCIALISM!!!! A big dead end.
Haven't you figured it out by now that the government is waaaaay smarter than we are and will be able to spend our money in a much better way and on better things than we can!
And oh yea, that 25 mil. that will be used to make "trails" ??
That will be challenged in court by an environmental group because the trail will threaten the habitat of a yellow throated sparrow or something and then the government will have to spend 8 or 10 mil. more to defend the legality of the trail ( down to one by now) and about 8 years later you will be able to PAY to ride on the "NEW" trail that is owned by a senators brother in law! And the 25-35 mil?....
That will be lining the pockets of the lawyers,insurance company's and politicians
that "Fought for or against the proposed "Trails"!
Oh and where does this trail lead?...................
SOCIALISM!!!! A big dead end.
#14
01-29-2009, 09:27 PM
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What do ya'll think about this?
This stimulus bill will be the worst thing to happen to the US economy since the New Deal, which prolonged the Great Depression. As much as I would like to have new ATV trails, the federal government has no business building them. This is just a sorry attempt to appease us into supporting their socialist crap.
#15
01-29-2009, 11:12 PM
What do ya'll think about this?
He's not giving anything. He's taking. Or proposing that congress take from one citizen and give it to another.
In any event building trails, or pretty much anything else in the pork bill for that matter, isn't the job of the federal government. The federal government has a very narrowly defined set of responsibilities set forth in the US Constitution.
This is what the Federal government is allowed to do under the Constitution of the United States Of America: (From the document itself)
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>
To borrow money on the credit of the United States;
To regulate commerce with foreign nations, and among the several states, and with the Indian tribes;
To establish a uniform rule of naturalization, and uniform laws on the subject of bankruptcies throughout the United States;
To coin money, regulate the value thereof, and of foreign coin, and fix the standard of weights and measures;
To provide for the punishment of counterfeiting the securities and current coin of the United States;
To establish post offices and post roads;
To promote the progress of science and useful arts, by securing for limited times to authors and inventors the exclusive right to their respective writings and discoveries;
To constitute tribunals inferior to the Supreme Court;
To define and punish piracies and felonies committed on the high seas, and offenses against the law of nations;
To declare war, grant letters of marque and reprisal, and make rules concerning captures on land and water;
To raise and support armies, but no appropriation of money to that use shall be for a longer term than two years;
To provide and maintain a navy;
To make rules for the government and regulation of the land and naval forces;
To provide for calling forth the militia to execute the laws of the union, suppress insurrections and repel invasions;
To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the militia, and for governing such part of them as may be employed in the service of the United States, reserving to the states respectively, the appointment of the officers, and the authority of training the militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;
To exercise exclusive legislation in all cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten miles square) as may, by cession of particular states, and the acceptance of Congress, become the seat of the government of the United States, and to exercise like authority over all places purchased by the consent of the legislature of the state in which the same shall be, for the erection of forts, magazines, arsenals, dockyards, and other needful buildings;--And
To make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the foregoing powers, and all other powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the United States, or in any department or officer thereof. </end quote></div>
That is what the federal government was instituted to do. Basically run the military and the district of columbia, manage trade, manage relations with foreign powers, run the post office, establish roads, coin money, protect patents and such. A very limited set of responsibilities. Anything else is forbidden by the Constitution and illegal.
If you'd like a little more reading look up the US Declaration Of Independence, particularly the list of grievances against the King Of England. Compare them to what we endure at the hands of the government today. I think I'd rather have lived under the boot of King George III.
In any event building trails, or pretty much anything else in the pork bill for that matter, isn't the job of the federal government. The federal government has a very narrowly defined set of responsibilities set forth in the US Constitution.
This is what the Federal government is allowed to do under the Constitution of the United States Of America: (From the document itself)
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>
To borrow money on the credit of the United States;
To regulate commerce with foreign nations, and among the several states, and with the Indian tribes;
To establish a uniform rule of naturalization, and uniform laws on the subject of bankruptcies throughout the United States;
To coin money, regulate the value thereof, and of foreign coin, and fix the standard of weights and measures;
To provide for the punishment of counterfeiting the securities and current coin of the United States;
To establish post offices and post roads;
To promote the progress of science and useful arts, by securing for limited times to authors and inventors the exclusive right to their respective writings and discoveries;
To constitute tribunals inferior to the Supreme Court;
To define and punish piracies and felonies committed on the high seas, and offenses against the law of nations;
To declare war, grant letters of marque and reprisal, and make rules concerning captures on land and water;
To raise and support armies, but no appropriation of money to that use shall be for a longer term than two years;
To provide and maintain a navy;
To make rules for the government and regulation of the land and naval forces;
To provide for calling forth the militia to execute the laws of the union, suppress insurrections and repel invasions;
To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the militia, and for governing such part of them as may be employed in the service of the United States, reserving to the states respectively, the appointment of the officers, and the authority of training the militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;
To exercise exclusive legislation in all cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten miles square) as may, by cession of particular states, and the acceptance of Congress, become the seat of the government of the United States, and to exercise like authority over all places purchased by the consent of the legislature of the state in which the same shall be, for the erection of forts, magazines, arsenals, dockyards, and other needful buildings;--And
To make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the foregoing powers, and all other powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the United States, or in any department or officer thereof. </end quote></div>
That is what the federal government was instituted to do. Basically run the military and the district of columbia, manage trade, manage relations with foreign powers, run the post office, establish roads, coin money, protect patents and such. A very limited set of responsibilities. Anything else is forbidden by the Constitution and illegal.
If you'd like a little more reading look up the US Declaration Of Independence, particularly the list of grievances against the King Of England. Compare them to what we endure at the hands of the government today. I think I'd rather have lived under the boot of King George III.
#16
01-29-2009, 11:28 PM
What do ya'll think about this?
Sorry folks...but I see things a bit different. IMHO...it is a GREAT thing to see $25 billion or $50 billion spent on ATV trails or anything else that deals with the GREAT outdoors that we Americans can enjoy.
I so enjoy this "Socialist" rhetoric. If that is the case, then the Federal Govt should STOP all Programs that help us Americans. How about Social Security? Or maybe the Medicare or Medicaid? Let's stop our tax dollars from helping the less fortunate too! Oops almost forgot to mention the $$$ for the infrastructure of our country. The roads, bridges, electric grid, underground pipes, etc. Let's just let it fall to crap. Makes sense...
Plus...who among us believe in Govt spending plans? Apparently not very many. But yet we spend billions of dollars for our Military. Not only in equipment, but in salary, medical, and all those benefits that make them the BEST they can be. How about we start cutting that too? Or better yet, all those Civil Servants that are employed by the Fed Govt...just let them go. Let them figure a way in the "private" world.
Unfortunately...that is just not reality. The "trickle" down effect doesn't work for most Americans. Reason...is that the money runs out if you are the one at the bottom (ie: the poor). Not everybody has the ability to work...or even had the opportunity to go to college or a secondary school. Keep in mind that Govt programs help the mentally challenged too. What should we stop helping them...because it's Socialism?
All this because the last 8yrs was so GREAT!?!? (laughing)
Ok...I am off my Soapbox...
So...as I said above...IMHO...it is a GREAT thing to see the money go towards a recreation that I love! Better than being ignored...
biz
I so enjoy this "Socialist" rhetoric. If that is the case, then the Federal Govt should STOP all Programs that help us Americans. How about Social Security? Or maybe the Medicare or Medicaid? Let's stop our tax dollars from helping the less fortunate too! Oops almost forgot to mention the $$$ for the infrastructure of our country. The roads, bridges, electric grid, underground pipes, etc. Let's just let it fall to crap. Makes sense...
Plus...who among us believe in Govt spending plans? Apparently not very many. But yet we spend billions of dollars for our Military. Not only in equipment, but in salary, medical, and all those benefits that make them the BEST they can be. How about we start cutting that too? Or better yet, all those Civil Servants that are employed by the Fed Govt...just let them go. Let them figure a way in the "private" world.
Unfortunately...that is just not reality. The "trickle" down effect doesn't work for most Americans. Reason...is that the money runs out if you are the one at the bottom (ie: the poor). Not everybody has the ability to work...or even had the opportunity to go to college or a secondary school. Keep in mind that Govt programs help the mentally challenged too. What should we stop helping them...because it's Socialism?
All this because the last 8yrs was so GREAT!?!? (laughing)
Ok...I am off my Soapbox...
So...as I said above...IMHO...it is a GREAT thing to see the money go towards a recreation that I love! Better than being ignored...
biz
#17
01-30-2009, 11:04 AM
What do ya'll think about this?
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: biz4two
Sorry folks...but I see things a bit different. IMHO...it is a GREAT thing to see $25 billion or $50 billion spent on ATV trails or anything else that deals with the GREAT outdoors that we Americans can enjoy.
I so enjoy this "Socialist" rhetoric. If that is the case, then the Federal Govt should STOP all Programs that help us Americans. How about Social Security? Or maybe the Medicare or Medicaid? Let's stop our tax dollars from helping the less fortunate too! Oops almost forgot to mention the $$$ for the infrastructure of our country. The roads, bridges, electric grid, underground pipes, etc. Let's just let it fall to crap. Makes sense...
Plus...who among us believe in Govt spending plans? Apparently not very many. But yet we spend billions of dollars for our Military. Not only in equipment, but in salary, medical, and all those benefits that make them the BEST they can be. How about we start cutting that too? Or better yet, all those Civil Servants that are employed by the Fed Govt...just let them go. Let them figure a way in the "private" world.
Unfortunately...that is just not reality. The "trickle" down effect doesn't work for most Americans. Reason...is that the money runs out if you are the one at the bottom (ie: the poor). Not everybody has the ability to work...or even had the opportunity to go to college or a secondary school. Keep in mind that Govt programs help the mentally challenged too. What should we stop helping them...because it's Socialism?
All this because the last 8yrs was so GREAT!?!? (laughing)
Ok...I am off my Soapbox...
So...as I said above...IMHO...it is a GREAT thing to see the money go towards a recreation that I love! Better than being ignored...
biz</end quote></div>
On the subject of social security.
That is an insurance paid for by the working people of the United States of America to insure that every person that has paid into it will have a secure retirement when reaching a predetermined age.
Social Security funds should have never been put into the GENERAL FUND...
It also should never be invested into any kinds of stockmarket.That money should be for the people that have worked hard to get to a point in their lives where they can benefit from it.
Sorry folks...but I see things a bit different. IMHO...it is a GREAT thing to see $25 billion or $50 billion spent on ATV trails or anything else that deals with the GREAT outdoors that we Americans can enjoy.
I so enjoy this "Socialist" rhetoric. If that is the case, then the Federal Govt should STOP all Programs that help us Americans. How about Social Security? Or maybe the Medicare or Medicaid? Let's stop our tax dollars from helping the less fortunate too! Oops almost forgot to mention the $$$ for the infrastructure of our country. The roads, bridges, electric grid, underground pipes, etc. Let's just let it fall to crap. Makes sense...
Plus...who among us believe in Govt spending plans? Apparently not very many. But yet we spend billions of dollars for our Military. Not only in equipment, but in salary, medical, and all those benefits that make them the BEST they can be. How about we start cutting that too? Or better yet, all those Civil Servants that are employed by the Fed Govt...just let them go. Let them figure a way in the "private" world.
Unfortunately...that is just not reality. The "trickle" down effect doesn't work for most Americans. Reason...is that the money runs out if you are the one at the bottom (ie: the poor). Not everybody has the ability to work...or even had the opportunity to go to college or a secondary school. Keep in mind that Govt programs help the mentally challenged too. What should we stop helping them...because it's Socialism?
All this because the last 8yrs was so GREAT!?!? (laughing)
Ok...I am off my Soapbox...
So...as I said above...IMHO...it is a GREAT thing to see the money go towards a recreation that I love! Better than being ignored...
biz</end quote></div>
On the subject of social security.
That is an insurance paid for by the working people of the United States of America to insure that every person that has paid into it will have a secure retirement when reaching a predetermined age.
Social Security funds should have never been put into the GENERAL FUND...
It also should never be invested into any kinds of stockmarket.That money should be for the people that have worked hard to get to a point in their lives where they can benefit from it.
#18
01-30-2009, 12:36 PM
Pro Rider
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What do ya'll think about this?
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: biz4two
Sorry folks...but I see things a bit different. IMHO...it is a GREAT thing to see $25 billion or $50 billion spent on ATV trails or anything else that deals with the GREAT outdoors that we Americans can enjoy.
I so enjoy this "Socialist" rhetoric. If that is the case, then the Federal Govt should STOP all Programs that help us Americans. How about Social Security? Or maybe the Medicare or Medicaid? Let's stop our tax dollars from helping the less fortunate too! Oops almost forgot to mention the $$$ for the infrastructure of our country. The roads, bridges, electric grid, underground pipes, etc. Let's just let it fall to crap. Makes sense...
Plus...who among us believe in Govt spending plans? Apparently not very many. But yet we spend billions of dollars for our Military. Not only in equipment, but in salary, medical, and all those benefits that make them the BEST they can be. How about we start cutting that too? Or better yet, all those Civil Servants that are employed by the Fed Govt...just let them go. Let them figure a way in the "private" world.
Unfortunately...that is just not reality. The "trickle" down effect doesn't work for most Americans. Reason...is that the money runs out if you are the one at the bottom (ie: the poor). Not everybody has the ability to work...or even had the opportunity to go to college or a secondary school. Keep in mind that Govt programs help the mentally challenged too. What should we stop helping them...because it's Socialism?
All this because the last 8yrs was so GREAT!?!? (laughing)
Ok...I am off my Soapbox...
So...as I said above...IMHO...it is a GREAT thing to see the money go towards a recreation that I love! Better than being ignored...
biz</end quote></div>
Well biz I wish you luck with that, Just go ahead and let the feds spend us further and further into debt and giving billions of tax payers $ to welfare drug addicted alcoholics and people that have never worked or payed fed. taxes in their whole lives. And at the same time send billions more tax payer $ to those country's with their hands out wanting foreign aid!
The government does need to spend money on the military and our infrastructure here in the states, but they are never satisfied with the billions they get.
If people could keep more of their own money then they would feel more inclined to help those that were truly in need of the help via charitable organizations and their churches etc.
While I save as much of my money as I can, a lot of people will go ahead and transfer their maxed out credit card balances to another card so they can max the first one out again and then expect to get bailed out (bankruptcy)! I wonder who will be ahead in a few years? You can't spend your way out of debt! And that is what the Obama administration wants to do!
If TAKING your money and redistributing it to those that don't work isn't socialism, then please let me know what is.
Just MY humble opinion!
Sorry folks...but I see things a bit different. IMHO...it is a GREAT thing to see $25 billion or $50 billion spent on ATV trails or anything else that deals with the GREAT outdoors that we Americans can enjoy.
I so enjoy this "Socialist" rhetoric. If that is the case, then the Federal Govt should STOP all Programs that help us Americans. How about Social Security? Or maybe the Medicare or Medicaid? Let's stop our tax dollars from helping the less fortunate too! Oops almost forgot to mention the $$$ for the infrastructure of our country. The roads, bridges, electric grid, underground pipes, etc. Let's just let it fall to crap. Makes sense...
Plus...who among us believe in Govt spending plans? Apparently not very many. But yet we spend billions of dollars for our Military. Not only in equipment, but in salary, medical, and all those benefits that make them the BEST they can be. How about we start cutting that too? Or better yet, all those Civil Servants that are employed by the Fed Govt...just let them go. Let them figure a way in the "private" world.
Unfortunately...that is just not reality. The "trickle" down effect doesn't work for most Americans. Reason...is that the money runs out if you are the one at the bottom (ie: the poor). Not everybody has the ability to work...or even had the opportunity to go to college or a secondary school. Keep in mind that Govt programs help the mentally challenged too. What should we stop helping them...because it's Socialism?
All this because the last 8yrs was so GREAT!?!? (laughing)
Ok...I am off my Soapbox...
So...as I said above...IMHO...it is a GREAT thing to see the money go towards a recreation that I love! Better than being ignored...
biz</end quote></div>
Well biz I wish you luck with that, Just go ahead and let the feds spend us further and further into debt and giving billions of tax payers $ to welfare drug addicted alcoholics and people that have never worked or payed fed. taxes in their whole lives. And at the same time send billions more tax payer $ to those country's with their hands out wanting foreign aid!
The government does need to spend money on the military and our infrastructure here in the states, but they are never satisfied with the billions they get.
If people could keep more of their own money then they would feel more inclined to help those that were truly in need of the help via charitable organizations and their churches etc.
While I save as much of my money as I can, a lot of people will go ahead and transfer their maxed out credit card balances to another card so they can max the first one out again and then expect to get bailed out (bankruptcy)! I wonder who will be ahead in a few years? You can't spend your way out of debt! And that is what the Obama administration wants to do!
If TAKING your money and redistributing it to those that don't work isn't socialism, then please let me know what is.
Just MY humble opinion!
#19
01-30-2009, 01:34 PM
#20
01-30-2009, 01:41 PM
What do ya'll think about this?
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: biz4two
I so enjoy this "Socialist" rhetoric. If that is the case, then the Federal Govt should STOP all Programs that help us Americans. How about Social Security? Or maybe the Medicare or Medicaid? </end quote></div>
Can we? PLEASE? They should most certainly be either eliminated or at the very least devolved to the states. Those programs are not compatible with American Liberty or our Constitutional Republican form of government set forth in the Constitution.
You lust after such programs and security? Fine. There are numerous countries in the world that are slopping over with cradle to grave socialism. Move there. There is ONE nation in the world where government was instituted to secure God given Liberty and freedom to the people and that country is the United States of America. You have an entire planet of socialist utopias to choose from. if you require a nanny to take care of you and keep you safe then those nations are happy to oblige. The Constitution of the US doesn't allow America to be such a country.
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: biz4twoOr better yet, all those Civil Servants that are employed by the Fed Govt...just let them go. Let them figure a way in the "private" world. </end quote></div>
You're full of GREAT Ideas! Get rid of government employees? Absolutely. A nice start would be cutting federal employees (parasites) by 50%. Heck and I can give you a half a dozen federal agencies and cabinet positions off the top of my head that should be eliminated.
Oh and the last 8 years WERE unrestrained socialism. The next four will be outright marxism.</end quote></div>
I so enjoy this "Socialist" rhetoric. If that is the case, then the Federal Govt should STOP all Programs that help us Americans. How about Social Security? Or maybe the Medicare or Medicaid? </end quote></div>
Can we? PLEASE? They should most certainly be either eliminated or at the very least devolved to the states. Those programs are not compatible with American Liberty or our Constitutional Republican form of government set forth in the Constitution.
You lust after such programs and security? Fine. There are numerous countries in the world that are slopping over with cradle to grave socialism. Move there. There is ONE nation in the world where government was instituted to secure God given Liberty and freedom to the people and that country is the United States of America. You have an entire planet of socialist utopias to choose from. if you require a nanny to take care of you and keep you safe then those nations are happy to oblige. The Constitution of the US doesn't allow America to be such a country.
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: biz4twoOr better yet, all those Civil Servants that are employed by the Fed Govt...just let them go. Let them figure a way in the "private" world. </end quote></div>
You're full of GREAT Ideas! Get rid of government employees? Absolutely. A nice start would be cutting federal employees (parasites) by 50%. Heck and I can give you a half a dozen federal agencies and cabinet positions off the top of my head that should be eliminated.
Oh and the last 8 years WERE unrestrained socialism. The next four will be outright marxism.</end quote></div>