Sorry CaptainQuint but you're wrong about the last line of your response![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
It's been at least the last 16 years!LOL[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]
How could you forget the Clintons?

 

It will give us something outside to do when we can no longer afford to own firearms or ammo. I agree with the fact that if you give it back to those of us that pay into it it would do more to stimulate the economy. If you have been recently employed you should count in the refund also. I dont understand how you all can be upset. The feds are going to spend us into prosperity. I agree that money should be spent on the infrastructure but I also agree that it should be done as the old wpa projects used to be. I believe to get govt. aid you should perform a service to receive the money. ie plant bushes, pick up trash, anything to earn the govt money. This does several things. It would probably lower the crime rate because who wants to get drunk/ high act a fool, get in trouble when you have to be at work at 8am.

 

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: biz4two



I so enjoy this "Socialist" rhetoric. If that is the case, then the Federal Govt should STOP all Programs that help us Americans. How about Social Security? Or maybe the Medicare or Medicaid? Let's stop our tax dollars from helping the less fortunate too! Oops almost forgot to mention the $$$ for the infrastructure of our country. The roads, bridges, electric grid, underground pipes, etc. Let's just let it fall to crap. Makes sense...

</end quote></div>



Absolutely the Federal Govt should stop all these programs.

Social Security? Its on its way to becoming bankrupt, let us save for retirement on our own.

Medicare and Medicaid? Anyone is free to purchase heath insurance from a private insurance company. If people did not have to pay taxes to fund these programs they would have enough money to buy their own.

Tax dollars for the less fortunate? The more that gets handed out to the "less fortunate", the more "less fortunate" there will be.

$$$ for infrastructure? Infrastructure should be tied to user fees
Gas taxes should exclusively pay for roads and bridges, electric bills can pay for the electric grid, and water bills can pay for underground pipes. It will not fall to crap. The market will dictate exactly how much these things need to cost, not a bunch of politician. This would also give us more cost effective energy like clean coal and nuclear, rather than a bunch of windmills that only work 20% of the time.

Socialism has always failed and free market capitalism has always succeeded.

 

if they would just ease up on the current restrictive laws that we have so we can go more places legally it would make it so much easier....

so,,,,to help the economy, i will volunteer to go make trails. if i can get at least a dozen people to follow me in 4WD,,,,, BOOM! we have an instant atv trail!!!! the possibilities are endless!

X

 

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: CaptainQuint

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: biz4two
I so enjoy this "Socialist" rhetoric. If that is the case, then the Federal Govt should STOP all Programs that help us Americans. How about Social Security? Or maybe the Medicare or Medicaid? </end quote></div>

Can we? PLEASE? They should most certainly be either eliminated or at the very least devolved to the states. Those programs are not compatible with American Liberty or our Constitutional Republican form of government set forth in the Constitution.


You lust after such programs and security? Fine. There are numerous countries in the world that are slopping over with cradle to grave socialism. Move there. There is ONE nation in the world where government was instituted to secure God given Liberty and freedom to the people and that country is the United States of America. You have an entire planet of socialist utopias to choose from. if you require a nanny to take care of you and keep you safe then those nations are happy to oblige. The Constitution of the US doesn't allow America to be such a country.



<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: biz4twoOr better yet, all those Civil Servants that are employed by the Fed Govt...just let them go. Let them figure a way in the "private" world. </end quote></div>


You're full of GREAT Ideas! Get rid of government employees? Absolutely. A nice start would be cutting federal employees (parasites) by 50%. Heck and I can give you a half a dozen federal agencies and cabinet positions off the top of my head that should be eliminated.

Oh and the last 8 years WERE unrestrained socialism. The next four will be outright marxism.</end quote></div></end quote></div>


CaptainQuint -- Actually...I am fine being an American and living in these United States...Thank You very much! However, since you appear to sleep with the Constitution (without the Amendments)...may I suggest you go find a nice little island maybe in the Pacific...and start over with your closed mind ideas. You would be better served there...where you can RULE with no opinion to oppose you.

Calling Civil Servants <u>"parasites"</u> is absolutely appalling in a Year of 2009. Wow...that is really sad...and I feel so sorry for you. These people dedicate themselves to serving there country and going above and beyond with little pay to show for it. Such a narrow mind...

--- Now on with the topic ---

Lets keep in mind folks...that if it were not for Govt spending those Billions of $$$, then where would NASA and the space program be? How about our Scientific National Labs? Or the Colleges? If it were not for Govt and the appropriations for healthcare...where would we be in the fight to cure cancer? YES...maybe private medical companies have a magic pill or some other contribution, but it was due to Federal Govt money to entice them.

I do see things differently...and try to keep an open-mind. It is my intention to support my Govt...and my NEW President in anyway that I can.


biz
[img]i/expressions/light.gif[/img]

 

Believe it or not, I don't hate Bush!! I think he has put all of his effort in keeping us safe since 9/11. Thank you Mr. Bush for doing all that you did to keep us safe. On the down side, it does seem like the economy had lost the front row seat. When it was "all of a sudden noticed that things were going down hill" it was too late to get out. If you look at it in a historic point of view, every 10 years or so we tend to go into an economic slump. Every 30 years or so it tends to be worse. I am a fan of the trickle down effect. I think as long as big business has the money to grow and spend, jobs will be there. Nobody wants to do all the work. If the money is there to spend people will hire other people to take the work load. As far as the big "stimulas bill", It seems like it is just a big build up of goverment to me. Alot of the jobs are goverment based, there is alot of pork in it that will have nothing to do with making jobs. This country is based off of free market, I don't want goverment to take over. As far as social security and medicare and medicade, I don't consider that a socialist act. We as tax payers pay for that and it is no different than a retirement investment. The atv trail grant is nothing. 25 million??? That would not even put gravel on the parking lots of the trails accross the country. I think it is just a ploy to get "conservative" minded thinkers to support it. The 400 million on a bird santuary is more important I guess. Alot of the spending will take 5-10 years to take effect and will be short term projects. I don't see it working. I do however want our economic situation to improve. I hope I am wrong in my opinion. I think us as Americans, will be the ultimate solution. The money is not gone. It is just in different peoples hands. If we can start spending and then the ball will begain rolling. Now I do think the lack of oversight in wall street needs an adjustment. If it takes goverment to step in and keep people honest, then I am for that. I think that is the root of the whole ression problem

 

Remember that the 25 mil. is in the stimulus plan.....this is on top of the government grants already given.

IMO, it is stimulus (the 25mil for atv trails) because people will buy trucks, trailers, atv's, gas, etc.......

Some of the other "oink" in the plan is to line pockets in order to get votes.

I personally don't have much faith in the new Pres., but I will keep an open mind. So far, it's been socialism creeping into everyone's lives. It is bad enough already.

 

"If it takes goverment to step in and keep people honest" Is this not the fox protecting the chicken coop? How absurd!!!

 

I think its a big crop of crap. You don`t really think they will build ATV trails and allow us all to ride them freely like we do now do you?? what they are trying to do is get there foot in the door so they can implement a trail pass system like they do now with the snowmobiles. back in the day before the trail passes the trails were rough and the boggies didn`t handle the high speeds very comfortably, well they built sleds with great suspensions that can handle the roughest of trail but we let the government in the door and now we all have to pay to be able to ride. I understand where the money goes (local clubs) but back in the day we all were riding the trails on the first snow now you can`t get on the trail until they say you can. I`m a property owner in Northern Ontario and the last 2 years we had enough snow to ride Dec1 but could get on the trail until the end of January. The way I see it and I may be wrong is if we all except the help from the government to help with the trails we may as well drop our pants and let the government have there way with us again. Next we will have to pay them another $250.00 just to be able to take our quads on "our" trails and that is of coarse when they say the trails are ok to ride on.
Also to add to this I don`t want the summer traffic across my property there has been enough damage caused to my gates and fences in the last 2 years. I sled and atv so i understand the importance the the trail system just leave it as it is. I`m very close to closing off a main trail because of damages so adding another season of traffic wouldn`t be a good thing.

Just my .02 and venting .

 

First off your vision is so clouded with thoughts of you getting free **** from other working Americans. You have no clue what the constitution even says do you. The ferderal government has 18 powers not the power to create all the social programs to take money from the workers and inefficeintly spend it on the people who arnt working.

Everything the government does and pays for cost atleast twice as much as a private sector person would pay. Why do you think big government is such a great thing when it so wildly inefficeintly.


The government drives cures for cancer and entices drug companies. You never speak a word about this again, because you have no fing clue how that system works. Since I work for a development company I can assure you that the government has an adverse affect on our reasearch and desire to synthesize medications. If the cure for cancer was developed the government would immidiatly take control over the entire marketing and cost control for the better good of humanity to save lives. ie why most companies are not concentrating on such research.

PS things were better with Bush He didnt waste 3.4 trillion dollars of money we dont have to have the unemployment go up after the fake temporary jobs went away.