Sorry to keep bringing this up....but I felt this deserved a new post, particular to status.

Can somebody summarize the current (as of Dec. '09) situation with Polaris and the XP balljoints? I've read on other forums about a safety bulletin and new ball joints (silver vs. gold), and some possible "kit" with a-arm modifications....There's all kinds of info over the last couple months and I don't know what to believe. Some say it's the same part number and no different than old. Where is Polaris with this

 

Here is the letter for those who haven't seen it....

 

As the dealer explained it to me and the letter confirmed, it's not a ball joint issue but an issue with keeping the ball joint stationary. So basically, they are putting stronger bolts, torqued to a higher spec, in the knuckles to fix the issue. If after that, you still have play, the dealers have an option to replace the knuckles as well. I suspect the majority of us will end up with 4 new shiny bolts and that'll be it.
Cheers,
cc

 

I've heard the same from someone very close to the situation... like doing the fix.

It seems that if the ball joints/knuckles are still good, you may just be getting new bolts. If the joints and/or knuckles are worn badly, you may be getting new joints and knuckles, which BTW... "visually" appear to be the same as the ones on the machine. That's not to say that the replacement joints/knuckles are not built to higher standards/tolerances... but they "look" to be the same. Who knows? They will do whatever they want. They may change the part number/supplier in the blink of an eye.

 

Yep..that is the case apparently. It has just been blanket labled a "ball joint" issue,the ball joints them selves are not what is getting loose..it is the balljoint getting loose in the knuckle,beings the joint is steel and the knuckle alum makes sense the wear or whatever is going to occur with the alum. THe problem is once the joint is allowed to move around it is subjected to stresses at angles that is wasn't designed to see. Also if the joint is allowed to move around it can accelerate in the bore during impacts ect,greatly increasing the possiblilty of a joint failure. I'm no engineer but anything that is supposed to be a tight fit that is allowed to move around is more likely to fail...ball joints,u-joints ect ect...play increases the stresses it sees dramatically.
The real issue has been known for awhile. I don' know if you've seen Jomax's posts around the boards. He ended up fixing his own after the dealer did their fix and it didn't work. IIRC he is a machinist,in any case he obviously knew what he was doing. The issue he found was larger variations in the diameter of the bore in the knuckle that the ball joint fits into. He checked the 4 bores on new knuckles(new but before Polaris's recall) and one of the bores was significanlty larger than the other 3,by significant I am only talking a few thousands of an inch..that is all it takes there. Just that little bit of size difference would be engough that even after upgrading to 10.9 Hardware and torquing it to the max tq for the upgraded hardware it would likely still be loose. You can only take up so much play with the pinch bolts without going to a larger bolt...which would require a complete redesign.
He ended up sleeving the knuckles,or actually wrapping the ball joints with very thin stainless shimstock, .001 or .002"" IIRC. On a side note IIRC he did note a variation in the diameter of the old ball joints and the new ones...the real issue seems to be a "Quality control" Issue...wonder if the affected parts are made in China lol.

The problem I have with Polaris' fix is leaving the choice to change the knuckles with the dealer...I don't think all dealer tech have the skills require to determine if the knuckle should be replaced. Sorry I said it...some do,but I'' bet some don't. Hopefully the instructions the dealers get are very specific and include taking measurements of the knuckle bores and tell them specifically what the limits are.
If they have reallt have the issue fixed and the new knuckes are without a doubt within spec. then they could gain alot of confidence IMO by just replacing the knuckes,joints ect and call it good rather than have the dealer determine IF they need replacement. I guess that would be too exxpensive though huh?

 

I took mine in 3 weeks ago for the recall on what has been posted as well as the rear axles. The rear axles came in last week...still waiting on the recall parts....

I wish if they are doing a recall they would stock up on the parts needed to be replaced so they can keep up with the demand on the machines they actually sold...perhaps they do...but it seems like it is not the case for me.

 

I agree Rod, and would go one step further. If it were me, and I were taking my machine back for this type of recall, In a nice way I would tell me dealer the following... This is a safety recall. You have the opportunity to fix it "correctly". Make sure that everything is perfect. If you don't fix it right, and it breaks and someone gets hurt, "SOMEBODY" will pay dearly.

They may take a closer look at the joints/knuckles, and if in doubt (or lack of skill) they may decide that replacing more stuff rather than less stuff is a better choice.

 

I've seen aftermarket ball joints online. Wonder if they're worth looking at on XPs if Polaris isn't going to properly address this.

 

Yep, I would give Polaris/Dealer one chance to fix them and then keep a close eye on them. If they don't hold up, I'd be looking for a quality aftermarket replacement. Probably wouldn't be cheap, but it would be worth the peace of mind.

 

I'd say no....reason being,again the Ball Joints themselves are not the root cause...the cause is the joints being loose in the knuckle..ie the bore in the knuckle likely being too arge and being a pinch bolt design the fact that they are alum. doesn't help. A little play quickly turns into a lot of play as the soft alum is moved around by the harder steel balljoint...so what gets ruined is the knuckle.. A replacement ball joint of the same size,not matter how high quality isn't going to fix the knuckle bore being to large...and since apparenlty the issue is a variation in bore diameters a larger diameter joint isn't the fix either really..just too many variables. Too small and it is loose,to large and it will not fit into the bore,you could drive it in...but would that be good for the alum knuckle? COuld that cause it too crack and fail? An aftermarket company would be dumb to try to skin the cat that way IMO.
Now if some one were to come out with some form of steel knuckle replacement,or even an alum knuckle, either of which utilized a threaded ball joint...now THAT would be the ticket and I that would be an upgrade worth doing IMO.

Before anyone asks...NO you can't use a threaded style ball joint with the current knuckle..that style is a taper fit and doesn't have a slot for a bolt to pinch together..just wouldn't work. I really wish Polaris would just go that that style set up and be done with it.