I hate to say I told you so, but........
#11
11-30-1999, 07:57 PM
What's up, You think that because a machine is faster, then it MUST beat everything else. SORRY, but handling is the name of the game, but good power dosn't hurt. Why do you think the first upgrade recommended is suspension for any bike, because no matter how much power you have, if you can't use it it's worthless. No I'm not Saying the DS is not be a great machine, but I'm not going to stoop to saying it is king, especially until I ride it myself!!! You do have to remember it is a very heavy sport quad, so even with good handling and suspension, it may still not be enough to beat a lighter more meneuverable machine like a 250R in motocross. I'd actually be surprised if it could come close in an MX race with an R or a 400EX for that matter. If it does, then good deal, and maybe I'd look at getting one someday. But as Bombadier said themselves, it's not ment as a racer, its ment for sport riding like in dunes (DS=Desert Storm), where it will stand a good chance at being king due to its speed. Personally I feel the R and 400EX will still rule the race scene, also woods riding requires good handling a menuevability, NOT SPEED. Why do you think the 250R still dominates even in the woods, I'm faster in the trails with my R than any 4-stroke I've ever owned. I think DS will be one heck of a duner and probably an excellent Desert Racer. But then again time will tell, the DS may undergo improvements (even the 400EX had flaws it's first year) to get it even better, or somebody will come out with something even better.
Also as far as saying the Quad is awsome then in your oppinion it doesn't look like they mean when tested with other things, well guess what, maybe they were excited, as everybody should be, to see a totally new sport quad and with a big motor. Maybe thats what they mean by awsome after all the years of waiting for something new. These things only help as it gets other manufactures looking, and possibly releasing something new and better.
So instead of getting your panties in a bunch and dissing the magazines because you don't like what they write (I think they know what they are talking about) why don't you just wait until you ride one yourself and make your own conclusions. I also have read all the articles, and they all say what I have said that it is an excellent duner and desert racer, but the MX track has yet to be determined as they will soon test it against other racers (thats seems like a good review to me). So COOL OFF, and wait a little bit, maybe you will see something you like, but then you may not. Again Time will tell...
Sickman
Also as far as saying the Quad is awsome then in your oppinion it doesn't look like they mean when tested with other things, well guess what, maybe they were excited, as everybody should be, to see a totally new sport quad and with a big motor. Maybe thats what they mean by awsome after all the years of waiting for something new. These things only help as it gets other manufactures looking, and possibly releasing something new and better.
So instead of getting your panties in a bunch and dissing the magazines because you don't like what they write (I think they know what they are talking about) why don't you just wait until you ride one yourself and make your own conclusions. I also have read all the articles, and they all say what I have said that it is an excellent duner and desert racer, but the MX track has yet to be determined as they will soon test it against other racers (thats seems like a good review to me). So COOL OFF, and wait a little bit, maybe you will see something you like, but then you may not. Again Time will tell...
Sickman
#12
12-01-1999, 08:55 AM
Sickman,
1st> I could care less about boring MX tracks? I see those guys racing in the Astrodome. I don't ride my quad in the house!!!
2nd> The point Mike & are were making was that Dirtwheels & 4 wheel action are morons. I read the mags just to laugh. Kind of like watching a Vanilla Ice movie.
There are 2 good magazines. ATV magazine & ATV Sport Magazine.
Dirtwheels = Hondawheels
Carcraft = Chevycraft
The analogy is the same. It's all in who pays the bills I guess.
My old TRX 125 rules !!!!!
I'm not scared of any ill handling Banshees & DS650's! I've got 125cc's of Honda power, "0" inches of suspension travel and I'm not afraid to use it !
------------------
Andrew Thomas
'99 Scrambler 400 & '99 Trailblazer, both with RCR mods.
1st> I could care less about boring MX tracks? I see those guys racing in the Astrodome. I don't ride my quad in the house!!!
2nd> The point Mike & are were making was that Dirtwheels & 4 wheel action are morons. I read the mags just to laugh. Kind of like watching a Vanilla Ice movie.
There are 2 good magazines. ATV magazine & ATV Sport Magazine.
Dirtwheels = Hondawheels
Carcraft = Chevycraft
The analogy is the same. It's all in who pays the bills I guess.
My old TRX 125 rules !!!!!
I'm not scared of any ill handling Banshees & DS650's! I've got 125cc's of Honda power, "0" inches of suspension travel and I'm not afraid to use it !
------------------
Andrew Thomas
'99 Scrambler 400 & '99 Trailblazer, both with RCR mods.
#13
12-01-1999, 09:21 AM
You guys all crack me up.
Oh course a magazine is going to be opinionated. Everyone is. It's human nature. But not all of us have several models of every atv on the market sitting in our back yards, waiting to test ride. If you don't like what the magazines say, then don't buy them. If you think that they favor Honda's. Maybe they do. Or maybe Honda atv's are the best.
I ride a Honda. Why? Because I went out. Looked at every model from every manufacture that pleased me. Rode them. Compared them on paper. Rode them again. And then brought one home.
It just seemed like it was in a class by itself.
You may feel differently about your machine. And I hope that you do. Because if I was out on the trail, and all's that I see were the same model that I rode. I would be sick.
The mix makes it fun.
Chris 00' 300EX
ps. I have no trouble staying with the almighty 400EX's with my little 300.
Oh course a magazine is going to be opinionated. Everyone is. It's human nature. But not all of us have several models of every atv on the market sitting in our back yards, waiting to test ride. If you don't like what the magazines say, then don't buy them. If you think that they favor Honda's. Maybe they do. Or maybe Honda atv's are the best.
I ride a Honda. Why? Because I went out. Looked at every model from every manufacture that pleased me. Rode them. Compared them on paper. Rode them again. And then brought one home.
It just seemed like it was in a class by itself.
You may feel differently about your machine. And I hope that you do. Because if I was out on the trail, and all's that I see were the same model that I rode. I would be sick.
The mix makes it fun.
Chris 00' 300EX
ps. I have no trouble staying with the almighty 400EX's with my little 300.
#14
12-01-1999, 04:41 PM
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cstark,
You missed the point of magazines and for that matter the news media in general. Reporting is supposed to be unbaiased in any way. The reporter is supposed to convey a description of the subject, it's high points, low points (in other words both sides of the subject) and general specifics. They are not supposed to provide oppinions based on politics or payola.
Check out the news on television if you want to see biased reporting. While the local stations around here seem to be pretty apolitical as far as news, all it takes is one look at the national news from the big networks to realize that they take a view slightly left of Fidel Castro. The same is true of Dirtwheels/4 Wheel ATV Action, only instead of the leftist view, they substitute Honda as their icon. Mr Thomas made a very good compairison between The magazine Car Craft and the two formerly mentioned magazines. Pick up a copy of car craft if you want to read up on Chevrolets. If you want information on other brands of cars, sorry you'll have to go elsewhere.
Frankly, the only reason that DW and 4WA even bother to review other quads is to make their precious Hondas look better. I commend you on your way of choosing a quad. Going out and actually riding the quads that you are interested in is a darn good way to choose between them. However, there are a lot of people out there who will take everything that the magazine says at face value, instead of with a ton of salt like they should. Just as there are actually people out in the world who believe that everything that the network news says is the absolute gospel. Go out and see the world for yourselves! Live a little! And for crying out loud, come to your own conclusions!
Wake up America!
------------------
Mike Chero 97 Polaris Sport 400L/ 97 Polaris Trailblazer 250ES
<A HREF="http://users.penn.com/~hal9000/mikeetta.html">MIKE & CELESTE'S ATV PAGE </A>
You missed the point of magazines and for that matter the news media in general. Reporting is supposed to be unbaiased in any way. The reporter is supposed to convey a description of the subject, it's high points, low points (in other words both sides of the subject) and general specifics. They are not supposed to provide oppinions based on politics or payola.
Check out the news on television if you want to see biased reporting. While the local stations around here seem to be pretty apolitical as far as news, all it takes is one look at the national news from the big networks to realize that they take a view slightly left of Fidel Castro. The same is true of Dirtwheels/4 Wheel ATV Action, only instead of the leftist view, they substitute Honda as their icon. Mr Thomas made a very good compairison between The magazine Car Craft and the two formerly mentioned magazines. Pick up a copy of car craft if you want to read up on Chevrolets. If you want information on other brands of cars, sorry you'll have to go elsewhere.
Frankly, the only reason that DW and 4WA even bother to review other quads is to make their precious Hondas look better. I commend you on your way of choosing a quad. Going out and actually riding the quads that you are interested in is a darn good way to choose between them. However, there are a lot of people out there who will take everything that the magazine says at face value, instead of with a ton of salt like they should. Just as there are actually people out in the world who believe that everything that the network news says is the absolute gospel. Go out and see the world for yourselves! Live a little! And for crying out loud, come to your own conclusions!
Wake up America!
------------------
Mike Chero 97 Polaris Sport 400L/ 97 Polaris Trailblazer 250ES
<A HREF="http://users.penn.com/~hal9000/mikeetta.html">MIKE & CELESTE'S ATV PAGE </A>
#15
12-01-1999, 05:38 PM
Hey Mike, I get your point loud and clear. But you and I both know that there is nothing that the two of us can do about it. I buy the magazines to read the articles and look at the ads. And most of the time I do not believe what I read.
There are so many atv manufactures and so many models too choose from for one reason.
There are a million different kinds of people out there.
Every model suits every one person differently. You know that, I know that.
We can just do the best we can to shut them people up in real life when I come across one on the trail.
There's nothing I like better than smoking a brand spankin' new 400EX out on the trail and watching the guys face when I jump over him. I may not teach him a lesson, but I leave him speachless in front of his starry-eyed buddies. The "best" machine is nothing, without the best rider.
Take pride in your ride and no one elses.
Chris 00' 300EX
There are so many atv manufactures and so many models too choose from for one reason.
There are a million different kinds of people out there.
Every model suits every one person differently. You know that, I know that.
We can just do the best we can to shut them people up in real life when I come across one on the trail.
There's nothing I like better than smoking a brand spankin' new 400EX out on the trail and watching the guys face when I jump over him. I may not teach him a lesson, but I leave him speachless in front of his starry-eyed buddies. The "best" machine is nothing, without the best rider.
Take pride in your ride and no one elses.
Chris 00' 300EX
#17
12-01-1999, 06:58 PM
I agree with SICKMAN.
First of all, Honda is top quality in about anything they make. Cars, ATVs, whatever. They don't just automatically become someones favorite just like that. There has to be something good there to make that happen. My mom's gone through 3 Chryslers(fell apart), while my dad's Accord that he's had all this time is still running strong, in great condition. Honda's combination of many different experiences such as this and great performance is what makes people favor honda products. The only reason ANYBODY(see posts in honda forum) doesn't like Honda is because they haven't had experiences with Honda. Something that's really pathetic that We've seen in this forum is that people will just "say" the've had a Honda and they will make stuff up that went wrong to make Honda look bad. Then they got a different brand and loved it to death, right? Yeah, right. Sorry, that's something that just isn't going to happen. I am not exaggerating when I say Honda is "untouchable", and certain people hate them because of this. They shouldn't let this effect the way they think about their machines, but they do. Criticizing Honda makes it look like "their" manufacturer is better. This type of crap is not needed, and in addition they praise their machines to make them look REAL good. Is this how the Polaris forum got so many posts?
As for the quads, well, the mags are probably right. Can't you understand that a quad which has crazy power and suspension travel may not match up to the overall combination of handling, decent power, rider friendliness, etc... of another?
[This message has been edited by RidE (edited 12-01-1999).]
First of all, Honda is top quality in about anything they make. Cars, ATVs, whatever. They don't just automatically become someones favorite just like that. There has to be something good there to make that happen. My mom's gone through 3 Chryslers(fell apart), while my dad's Accord that he's had all this time is still running strong, in great condition. Honda's combination of many different experiences such as this and great performance is what makes people favor honda products. The only reason ANYBODY(see posts in honda forum) doesn't like Honda is because they haven't had experiences with Honda. Something that's really pathetic that We've seen in this forum is that people will just "say" the've had a Honda and they will make stuff up that went wrong to make Honda look bad. Then they got a different brand and loved it to death, right? Yeah, right. Sorry, that's something that just isn't going to happen. I am not exaggerating when I say Honda is "untouchable", and certain people hate them because of this. They shouldn't let this effect the way they think about their machines, but they do. Criticizing Honda makes it look like "their" manufacturer is better. This type of crap is not needed, and in addition they praise their machines to make them look REAL good. Is this how the Polaris forum got so many posts?
As for the quads, well, the mags are probably right. Can't you understand that a quad which has crazy power and suspension travel may not match up to the overall combination of handling, decent power, rider friendliness, etc... of another?
[This message has been edited by RidE (edited 12-01-1999).]
#20
12-02-1999, 07:09 PM
Most major car magazines rate Toyota #1 in reliability.
Anyone, who claims that Honda is "untouchable", has never owned a Honda Odyssey.
Ride, I have ridden Honda's since I was 9 (ATC 90) and I have had my share of problems with them, though overall, probably not anymore than any other ATV. For you to say that anyone who has reported problems with thier Honda is making it up and doing it just to make Honda look bad is just plain silly. If that were the case then I guess we could say that anyone who says a good thing about Honda is also making it up and saying it just to make Honda look good.
“Can't you understand that a quad which has crazy power and suspension travel may not match up to the overall combination of handling, decent power, rider friendliness, etc... of another? “
Can’t you understand that DS650 might have Honda beat in most categories? Until they hit the market we won’t know. We certainly can’t depend on DW to tell us can we? This brings me to my next point: You have never seen a DS650 in person, or ridden one have you? Yet due to your Honda prejudice you automatically assume your Honda will be better! You must also remember that not everyone considers “the overall combination of handling, decent power, rider friendliness combination “ to be the ideal. Some people prefer the “INSANE power, decent handling and rider friendliness” combination.
“Criticizing Honda makes it look like "their" manufacturer is better. This type of crap is not needed, and in addition they praise their machines to make them look REAL good. Is this how the Polaris forum got so many posts?”
You don’t seem to have a problem bashing other peoples brands (Polaris) and then bragging about how great yours is. Are you holding other people to a higher standard than yourself?
If I may quote you one last time, as you are correct about one thing: “This type of crap is not needed”
Eric Zeh
’85 Honda FL350R
Anyone, who claims that Honda is "untouchable", has never owned a Honda Odyssey.
Ride, I have ridden Honda's since I was 9 (ATC 90) and I have had my share of problems with them, though overall, probably not anymore than any other ATV. For you to say that anyone who has reported problems with thier Honda is making it up and doing it just to make Honda look bad is just plain silly. If that were the case then I guess we could say that anyone who says a good thing about Honda is also making it up and saying it just to make Honda look good.
“Can't you understand that a quad which has crazy power and suspension travel may not match up to the overall combination of handling, decent power, rider friendliness, etc... of another? “
Can’t you understand that DS650 might have Honda beat in most categories? Until they hit the market we won’t know. We certainly can’t depend on DW to tell us can we? This brings me to my next point: You have never seen a DS650 in person, or ridden one have you? Yet due to your Honda prejudice you automatically assume your Honda will be better! You must also remember that not everyone considers “the overall combination of handling, decent power, rider friendliness combination “ to be the ideal. Some people prefer the “INSANE power, decent handling and rider friendliness” combination.
“Criticizing Honda makes it look like "their" manufacturer is better. This type of crap is not needed, and in addition they praise their machines to make them look REAL good. Is this how the Polaris forum got so many posts?”
You don’t seem to have a problem bashing other peoples brands (Polaris) and then bragging about how great yours is. Are you holding other people to a higher standard than yourself?
If I may quote you one last time, as you are correct about one thing: “This type of crap is not needed”
Eric Zeh
’85 Honda FL350R