Towing vehicle Q.......
#21
07-26-2006, 08:06 PM
Towing vehicle Q.......
Originally posted by: JeffinTD
2fun,
Do you have an idea what your price range is going to be? That would give a better idea of what year range you would be looking at.
I agree with the above that the Dodges were louder, but 03 and after are quite a bit quieter. Cummins warranty is 7 years/100,000 but if I recall 10 year 300,000 is optional. 03 also saw the introduction of the 48RE auto, which is plenty strong unless the engine is turned up significantly w/o modifying the transmission. It's big disadvantate is that it is only a 4 speed auto. Since I prefer a stick, it wasn't an issue.
I also agree with the above (like I posed earlier) that I'm not a fan of the 6.0. 04 saw Ford's warranty costs go up $500,000,000, mostly due to that engine. The city I work for bought 7, and last I talked to the public works mechanic, he told me only 2 had not had a major engine problem. Later 6.0's are supposed to be better, and from what I understand none of the replacement engines has had a problem.
Article
Obviously there are plenty of people who have had a good 6.0, and I like the fit and finish of Ford better than the other 3...
The Duramax did have some injector issues, but they are apparently pretty rare. My neighbor drives a Duramax powered roll bed, and it broke down a couple months ago which turned out to be bad injectors, but it has over 200,000 hard use miles. Everyone else I know that has had one has had no problems at all. If you want an auto, the Allison in the GM's is hands down the best automatic.
Whatever you get, I'd get the higher (numerically lower) gear ratio, since you aren't going to tow that heavy (for a diesel pickup). Newer Dodges come with AAM axles (I think Ford uses them also) in either 4.10 or 3.73, for example. If your trailer is under say 12,000 pounds the 3.73 will tow fine, and give better fuel economy by turning lower RPMs on the freeway.
BTW, I see you are in my neck of the woods. If you end up in The Dalles, I'd recommend seeing Mike Urness at Urness motors. He's one of the few people in the auto sales industry that I really trust- honest, friendly, and he knows his diesel trucks. I think there is also a used trailer in good conditon like what you are looking for over at Nelson Exhaust.
2fun,
Do you have an idea what your price range is going to be? That would give a better idea of what year range you would be looking at.
I agree with the above that the Dodges were louder, but 03 and after are quite a bit quieter. Cummins warranty is 7 years/100,000 but if I recall 10 year 300,000 is optional. 03 also saw the introduction of the 48RE auto, which is plenty strong unless the engine is turned up significantly w/o modifying the transmission. It's big disadvantate is that it is only a 4 speed auto. Since I prefer a stick, it wasn't an issue.
I also agree with the above (like I posed earlier) that I'm not a fan of the 6.0. 04 saw Ford's warranty costs go up $500,000,000, mostly due to that engine. The city I work for bought 7, and last I talked to the public works mechanic, he told me only 2 had not had a major engine problem. Later 6.0's are supposed to be better, and from what I understand none of the replacement engines has had a problem.
Article
Obviously there are plenty of people who have had a good 6.0, and I like the fit and finish of Ford better than the other 3...
The Duramax did have some injector issues, but they are apparently pretty rare. My neighbor drives a Duramax powered roll bed, and it broke down a couple months ago which turned out to be bad injectors, but it has over 200,000 hard use miles. Everyone else I know that has had one has had no problems at all. If you want an auto, the Allison in the GM's is hands down the best automatic.
Whatever you get, I'd get the higher (numerically lower) gear ratio, since you aren't going to tow that heavy (for a diesel pickup). Newer Dodges come with AAM axles (I think Ford uses them also) in either 4.10 or 3.73, for example. If your trailer is under say 12,000 pounds the 3.73 will tow fine, and give better fuel economy by turning lower RPMs on the freeway.
BTW, I see you are in my neck of the woods. If you end up in The Dalles, I'd recommend seeing Mike Urness at Urness motors. He's one of the few people in the auto sales industry that I really trust- honest, friendly, and he knows his diesel trucks. I think there is also a used trailer in good conditon like what you are looking for over at Nelson Exhaust.
Thanks JeffinTD, and everyone else!
My price range....... LOL..
As inexpensive as possible while still getting a reliable 4X4 4-door with enough power to comfortably pull a loaded enclosed trailer.
I was hoping to get a nice used one for around 20,000 dollars if possible???
Am I way off base here, or am I looking at closer to 30,000 for the above mentioned 4X4??
#22
07-26-2006, 11:54 PM
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Towing vehicle Q.......
I'm just a back yard mechanic, but wanted to add my two cents anyway..... The earlier GM deisels..... Junk, it's what they put in the military CUCV's and HUMWV'S (Humvees), junk, junk, junk. Constantly working on them if they start. We just got a new duramax at my state job and while the motor and transmission seem to do well the front suspension of the 2500 is mushy while the rear end has tons of rebound. It is a miserable driving and towing vehicle. the Dodges...... My father has a 93 cumins with almost 300,000 miles on it, that is impressive if you know my father. He only performs maintenance on stuff if it makes a noise or quits running. He has also only changed the water pump. He did have to change the transmission, but that was due to a tree stump that tore off the transmission fluid cooling line while cutting wood. We got a 04 Cumins at my Federal Job and I loved if from the first time I drove cross country with it. It really took a beating and towed our trailers extreemely well. Liked it so much I purchased one and tow a 36ft toy hauler trailer with it at least twice a month. I also tow my 7 X 14 trailer with 3 4 wheelers on it and one in the bed. as for the Fords........ I don't know. We had a 99 powerstroke at my state job, it was a pig and drove like a tank but got the job done. It always started, belched black smoke, but once again got the job done. It got replaced by the 06 chevy, I miss the 99 Ford.
#23
07-27-2006, 12:54 AM
Towing vehicle Q.......
2fun,
Just messing around on kbb.com, a 2003 Dodge SLT 4x4, w/HO Cummins 6 speed long box quad cab, with 50,000 in good condition has a private party value around $25,000.
Dodges prior to 2003 didn't have a cab with 4 normal doors. The ones after 2003 are acutally a few inches shorter than the crew cab of Chevy or Dodge, but there is still enough room for a full sized adult.
If you wanted to go older and wanted a crew cab, that would leave a 7.3 Ford, or a Chevy, but I would think you should be able to find something pretty nice in the range you are looking at.
My truck, a single rear wheel 3500 4x4 w/HO Cummins 6 speed, jake, loaded Laramie power heated leather everything, super clean, and 30,000 miles would probably sell for less than $30,000.
Just messing around on kbb.com, a 2003 Dodge SLT 4x4, w/HO Cummins 6 speed long box quad cab, with 50,000 in good condition has a private party value around $25,000.
Dodges prior to 2003 didn't have a cab with 4 normal doors. The ones after 2003 are acutally a few inches shorter than the crew cab of Chevy or Dodge, but there is still enough room for a full sized adult.
If you wanted to go older and wanted a crew cab, that would leave a 7.3 Ford, or a Chevy, but I would think you should be able to find something pretty nice in the range you are looking at.
My truck, a single rear wheel 3500 4x4 w/HO Cummins 6 speed, jake, loaded Laramie power heated leather everything, super clean, and 30,000 miles would probably sell for less than $30,000.
#24
07-27-2006, 04:49 AM
Towing vehicle Q.......
Originally posted by: JeffinTD
2fun,
Just messing around on kbb.com, a 2003 Dodge SLT 4x4, w/HO Cummins 6 speed long box quad cab, with 50,000 in good condition has a private party value around $25,000.
Dodges prior to 2003 didn't have a cab with 4 normal doors. The ones after 2003 are acutally a few inches shorter than the crew cab of Chevy or Dodge, but there is still enough room for a full sized adult.
If you wanted to go older and wanted a crew cab, that would leave a 7.3 Ford, or a Chevy, but I would think you should be able to find something pretty nice in the range you are looking at.
My truck, a single rear wheel 3500 4x4 w/HO Cummins 6 speed, jake, loaded Laramie power heated leather everything, super clean, and 30,000 miles would probably sell for less than $30,000.
2fun,
Just messing around on kbb.com, a 2003 Dodge SLT 4x4, w/HO Cummins 6 speed long box quad cab, with 50,000 in good condition has a private party value around $25,000.
Dodges prior to 2003 didn't have a cab with 4 normal doors. The ones after 2003 are acutally a few inches shorter than the crew cab of Chevy or Dodge, but there is still enough room for a full sized adult.
If you wanted to go older and wanted a crew cab, that would leave a 7.3 Ford, or a Chevy, but I would think you should be able to find something pretty nice in the range you are looking at.
My truck, a single rear wheel 3500 4x4 w/HO Cummins 6 speed, jake, loaded Laramie power heated leather everything, super clean, and 30,000 miles would probably sell for less than $30,000.
#25
07-27-2006, 09:54 AM
Towing vehicle Q.......
Yeah, just look over whatever you are looking at pretty good.
A buddy of mine bought a nice looking 03 Laramie, like mine only black, for a pretty cheap price. It's got over 100,000, lifted, big tires, aftermarket injectors and clutch, a goose neck ball, and the remains of a propane injection system. Personally, anything with significant hot rod parts would make me a bit leery, especially when set up to tow large trailers, and no exhaust gas pyrometer.
A buddy of mine bought a nice looking 03 Laramie, like mine only black, for a pretty cheap price. It's got over 100,000, lifted, big tires, aftermarket injectors and clutch, a goose neck ball, and the remains of a propane injection system. Personally, anything with significant hot rod parts would make me a bit leery, especially when set up to tow large trailers, and no exhaust gas pyrometer.
#26
07-31-2006, 12:08 AM
#27
07-31-2006, 12:08 PM
Towing vehicle Q.......
In Dodge anyway, there may be some gas engines that are offered in both half tons and 3/4 tons. Back when I had a gas Ford truck, the 300 6 was the base engine for 1/2 ton trucks, and 302 or 351 V8's were optional. In 3/4 T, I think the 351 V8 was the base motor, with V10 and diesel as options.
1/2 and 3/4 ton Dodges use the same brand and same axle ratio (AAM in 4.10 or 3.73), and same tire size, so they might seem similar, but they aren't.
The rear axle on a 1/2 ton, is a 9 1/4" diameter ring gear. The ring gear that comes with HO Cummins is 11 1/2" (much beefier), with 8 lug wheels (instead of 5) that require 135 ft pounds at the lug nuts. The Cummins it's self weighs 900 and something pounds, so it would overload the front axle that comes on a 1500. The brakes are also way beefier.
Also, though the tires are the same size, the ones on the 3/4 and up are Load Range E, which are rated for something like 3,195 pounds of load each @ 80 psi.
The frames also appear similar, but the 3/4 and 1 ton ones are higher strength. The 1/2 tons use a rack and pinion steering, and the 3/4 tons use a stronger recirculating ball steering box. The suspension is also much burlier. 2,200 pounds in the bed barely levels my truck out, but it would squash a 1/2 ton (and be illegally overloaded).
Anyhow, there is more to how a truck tows than just the engine, and quite a few things are different between 1500s and 2500's.
I had occasion to tow a bumper pull RV trailer with my F150, probably similar or a bit heavier than the weight you are looking at. Although it did it, it felt like the truck was really working, and also it wasn't very relaxing to drive. Kind of felt like things would get dicy if someone pulled out in front of you, or whatever.
With my current truck, I would have known that trailer was back there, but it would have handled it with authority and a more secure feeling.
Only you can decide, but if you get a half ton, I suspect you will regret it.
1/2 and 3/4 ton Dodges use the same brand and same axle ratio (AAM in 4.10 or 3.73), and same tire size, so they might seem similar, but they aren't.
The rear axle on a 1/2 ton, is a 9 1/4" diameter ring gear. The ring gear that comes with HO Cummins is 11 1/2" (much beefier), with 8 lug wheels (instead of 5) that require 135 ft pounds at the lug nuts. The Cummins it's self weighs 900 and something pounds, so it would overload the front axle that comes on a 1500. The brakes are also way beefier.
Also, though the tires are the same size, the ones on the 3/4 and up are Load Range E, which are rated for something like 3,195 pounds of load each @ 80 psi.
The frames also appear similar, but the 3/4 and 1 ton ones are higher strength. The 1/2 tons use a rack and pinion steering, and the 3/4 tons use a stronger recirculating ball steering box. The suspension is also much burlier. 2,200 pounds in the bed barely levels my truck out, but it would squash a 1/2 ton (and be illegally overloaded).
Anyhow, there is more to how a truck tows than just the engine, and quite a few things are different between 1500s and 2500's.
I had occasion to tow a bumper pull RV trailer with my F150, probably similar or a bit heavier than the weight you are looking at. Although it did it, it felt like the truck was really working, and also it wasn't very relaxing to drive. Kind of felt like things would get dicy if someone pulled out in front of you, or whatever.
With my current truck, I would have known that trailer was back there, but it would have handled it with authority and a more secure feeling.
Only you can decide, but if you get a half ton, I suspect you will regret it.
#28
07-31-2006, 11:29 PM
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Towing vehicle Q.......
I towed a 26ft jayco for 2 years with a 1500 dodge with 3.92 gears, while it was geared low for a half ton I watched deisel after deisel pass me on the left going uphill. I just never felt comfortable pulling with it. I purchased a 2500 Dodge cummins and towed the trailer with it.... The difference was night and day. The 2500 made the tow much more pleasurable and I no longer sweated the long pulls....... If you are buying now, go with the 3/4 ton.
#29
08-01-2006, 05:11 AM
Towing vehicle Q.......
Well you guys have certainly given me a lot to think about!
I sure do appreciate all of the info you have given me on this! [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
It probably won't be till next spring or so, but I think I am going to go with a 3/4 ton diesel 4X4 (preferrably crew cab/4 door).
I want to be able to haul 4 people if possible, and be able to tow the trailer without worry of getting pushed off of the road![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif[/img]
I thought that with an enclosed trailer, I would have no problem with a 1/2 ton PU, but sounds like I would have regretted it in the long run??
Again, thanks to everyone for your input! I truly do appreciate it! [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
I sure do appreciate all of the info you have given me on this! [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
It probably won't be till next spring or so, but I think I am going to go with a 3/4 ton diesel 4X4 (preferrably crew cab/4 door).
I want to be able to haul 4 people if possible, and be able to tow the trailer without worry of getting pushed off of the road![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif[/img]
I thought that with an enclosed trailer, I would have no problem with a 1/2 ton PU, but sounds like I would have regretted it in the long run??
Again, thanks to everyone for your input! I truly do appreciate it! [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
