now just throw a stonewall, logs, muddy ground in, and no running start at all... see how good that raptor does. most of my friends all ride sport quads or dirtbikes, but ill never get off the 4wd... they see some big logs and rocks in the trail, and wonder where to go around... me, i just hit 4wd and fly right over with no probs, and they all just shake their heads... once in a while one will try to follow, only to get stuck and require towing from me. now when im riding with the other group, theyre all foremans, sportsmans, all the utilities. well i can still follow em, but i still fly by em in the opens.

ill never get off the 4wd...

 

your friends must not know how to ride, like I said I will have to see it to belive it, I can go over logs rock walls what ever, that's what skid plates are for. And anything you can make with out momentum I can make. I'm not knocking utility riders, I'm just saying dont think a sport quad cant go where you go, look at the VW bug, they run the Baja 1000 in stock form, It's all about the rider!! I know how to work my raptor and it has the power to do what I ask of it. BUt I am saying there are hills I climb that almost no utility quad can climb, unless it has alot done to it, and evan at that it probally wont make it. The small hills we ride are too much for most Grizzlys and polaris 700's I have only seen 1 go up the small hill and it barley made it!! The only place you got me is in the deep mud and water, but paddles will solve the mud and with the same mods as a utility the water would be no problem. And if a log is to big I can lift my quad over it, if a hill is too steep you cant push yours up it!!

 

An example of what a sport quad can climb that a utility quad cannot:

On the east side of Sand Mountain UT there are some insanely steep and long sand hillclimbs (almost 700 feet high). I had a Team Green Prairie 700 4x4 that had a Four Stroke Tech 800cc big bore, head porting, modded airbox, HMF Penland exhaust, and 25" Skat Trak Extreme paddle tires. I managed to find a hillclimb that I could NOT make, irregardless of how much run I had at the hill, whether I tried it in low range, high range, 2-wheel drive, or 4-wheel drive, or used the diff lock or not. My Prairie 800 simply could not make this one hill, because it would just dig in about 50 feet down from the top. I had been spending the day beating sport quads at drag races, and finding steeper and steeper hills to climb, and had finally found one hill that I could not climb. I didn't feel too badly about that until a built Banshee noticed I wasn't making the hill, and came over to show me up. He flew over the top like it wasn't even there, it wasn't even a challenge for that Banshee.

An example of what a utility ATV can climb that a sport quad cannot:

Anything hairy enough that I don't dare use the speed is my friend approach. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

 

see, when you use your skidplates, if you hit rear swingarm, you lost traction. the 2wd isnt as good for these hills, you get no momentum whatsoever. you running start is a quad's length, into logs, rocks, ruts, that all require 4wd. ive seen good riders try it on a sport and it just doesnt happen. they cant get the traction. i know on those real long hills that give momentum the sport quad will do better, but in the short nasty ones, where you hit 4wd before you even start to go at it...

 

That may be true out west in the desert and sand conditions.
But come to West Virginia and ride with me for a weekend in
these hills and I will change your mind. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

 

Let me just say this:

You can add sport to the utility but you can't put the utility in the sport.

nuff said. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

SilverBear

 

Adding sport to the utilities doesn't do all that much to the overall picture though. I tried with a Team Green Prairie 700, and it doesn't make enough overall difference to be worth the expense. I added a Four Stroke Tech 800cc big bore; with cams, head porting, and an HMF Penland racing exhaust; Elka front springs; Works rear shock; ITP wheels; and Holeshot ATR tires. It was real fast and had a whole lot of power, but it was still 600 lbs, and still handled like a Utility ATV, and still felt like a utility ATV. Probably a lot like Silverbears Grizzly 727 does. To have a sporty ATV you need to start with a sport ATV chassis, with proper chassis and suspension geometry, and a weight that is at least 250 lbs less than a utility ATV. Sorry, but in my opinion the current crop of sport utility ATVs are pigs with wheels, that have the term "sport" tacked on to their name. Even if you make them faster, you still have a fast pig. And even the most "sporty" utility ATV is not one bit sporty when compared to a real sport vehicle.

Handling and suspension issues aside, lets just talk power to weight ratio for a second here. The HP figures I use may not be exact, but they are close enough, and the numbers represent how many pounds there are for each HP, so a lower number is better...

<u>Utility ATVs</u>
Yamaha Grizzly 660: ........ 14.4
Kawasaki Prairie 700:...... 14.1

<u>Sport ATVs</u>
Raptor 660: .................. 9.3
YFZ 450: ....................... 7.9

<u>Bikes</u>
KTM 525 MXC: ......... 4.5
Yamaha YZF R1: ...... 2.1


Just something to think about when you think you have lots of performance with your utility ATV. The manufacturers need to double, or triple thier HP output with utility ATVs, and then build a chassis that can put that power to the ground safely, only then can we brag about how much performance our utility ATVs have.

Silverbear, I respect you, and I respect what you have done with your ATV. I didn't mean to dis you in any way. Peace out. DV

 

Desert Viper~

No offence taken. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

Trust me, I'm well aware of power to weight ratio's, and suspension tuning, and think perhaps you are being more literal than the rest of us. It's obvious that you put a lot of time and energy into your sport quads, and enjoy their features tremendously. My quad is an IRS machine, how "sporty" is that? Bottom line is I think most folks associate sport quads with "going fast", "doing wheelies," "being able to power burn out while moving", etc. My point being you can make a utility to all that via after market, and yes, make it go "scary fast", but you can not put a 4X4 front diff or chassis design which gives ground clearance on a sport quad or modify it with after market parts that will allow it to win a tractor pull.

Gone are the days utes are lumbering 45mph pigs that don't quite have the power to haul their own bulk. While my quad isn't a YFZ by any stretch of the imagination, you'd likely be surprised how many sport quads my personal "pig on wheels" has smoked in the drag races. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

I have never tried duning, but hopefully will make it to St Anthonies this year, then I'll be able to see how well/poor a utiliy does in the sand...admittedly another domain owned by the true sport quad. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-cool.gif[/img]

I simply enjoy the sport of ATVing, and for my personal riding habits, utilities, along with the possibilities they bring to the table, offered me more then the pure sport quad.


SilverBear

 

Point taken Silverbear. My Prairie 800 could easily beat a Raptor or YFZ in a drag race, too bad I couldn't make it feel like a sport quad. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

Have fun at St. Anthony's, it is one awesome place to go riding. I would be VERY interested in hearing whether or not your Grizzly 727 makes it up Choke Cherry hill. Thanks for not getting offended.

DV

 

DesertViper~

My brother in law (rides a quadzilla) has been working on me to make the time for the trip, and I think I will this year. I will let you know how the grizz does, and he has mentioned that particular hill to me as well. Must be a wicked one. I would have loved to put some seat time on your prairie, not too many people go that far on modifying utility quads. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

Speaking of which, my last mod on the grizz is an Elka suspension. I have the quote, and it would be the single most expensive mod on my quad. I haven't found anyone who has put an Elka Suspension on a highly modified ute, except you on your prairie. Was the suspension worth the money in your honest opinion?

Thanks so much!

SilverBear