posted a question earlier, still unsure of engine size of my Kazuma. Anyway, it ran pretty good after sitting and carb cleaned. Had some starter button issues, almost like the battery was going, but it would start fine with some repeated pushes on the button. Then the starter button quit altogether, wouldn't work. When I jumped the starter solenoid with a screw driver, it would start fine, no hesitating. I disconnected the neg ground on battery and I examined all connections, starter button and kill switch, all wires. I even disconnected the ones on the solenoid. Everything looked fine. Well, I went to connect ground cable back to battery and it turned the engine over. Now I cannot connect the battery back up because the engine turns over every time. I tried to see if I could start it the way, but it would just drain the battery. It wouldn't even take a jump with cables to my truck. Anyone have any ideas, please? Alos correct me if I'm wrong, but shouldn't the voltage reading at the starter motor be at least 12? Mine was reading just over 6 with 12.7 at the battery. Thanks.

 

There are multiple issues going on here: Flakey start button, intermittent starter, possible battery "going", some previous carburetion issues, and now a shorted solenoid after having a bunch of wires off, and then being reinstalled.

One thing at a time. Let's take the starter turning whenever you hook up the quad battery first:

The only device that interrupts the direct connection between the battery and the starter is the starter solenoid. Make sure you have wired this correctly. The positive battery post has a fat red wire that goes to one screw post on the starter solenoid. The other screw post on the solenoid has another fat red wire that goes on down to the starter motor. Look carefully to make sure these two wires are wired as described, and not touching each other at the solenoid posts.

Next disconnect the two small wires going to the starter solenoid. Does the starter still turn when you hook up the battery?

If you don't find that your starter solenoid screw terminal wires are touching, and the big fat wires are wired correctly, and the quad starter still turns with the two small solenoid input wires disconnected, then your solenoid is bad.

Let's get the starter motor behaving first, then move on to other stuff...

 

Thanks for your reply. The wires into the solenoid were reconnected as they were before and as you described. Since I was at a loss and thinking that it could be solenoid issue, I disconnected pos cable from battery and then ran a cable straight from pos terminal on battery to starter and the engine still turned over with neg cable to battery neg post. Not sure if this would have diagnosed a solenoid problem. I also disconnected the 2 wires you mentioned from the solenoid where they plug into the wires to the starter button, this was after everything was put back together and still fired as above. Thanks, again for your help.

 

LynnEdwards, I will get a new solenoid and get back with you.

 

Let me clarify starter issue. The starter was starting to act weak and not turning the engine. I removed the spark plug and there was no change in the way the starter was acting so that is when I bypassed the solenoid. Wanted to see if there was a change w/o solenoid and bypassing the existing wire from solenoid to starter.
Sorry, earlier post about this was confusing.

 

Hmmm. I guess I'm now more confused than before.

If you hook everything back (including the battery, solenoid and starter motor) with the ignition switch turned off, dies the starter motor turn by itself without the being ignition on?

Or is the main problem that the starter motor doesn't turn like it should when you push the start button?

 

Sorry, trying to be as detailed as possible in as few words as possible and it isn't coming out right. The starter and the electrical issue became 2 separate issues. Right now everything is reconnected to original. When I touch ground cable to neg post on battery, the engine turns over. Even when the 'on/off' switch is off. Even when the fuse to pos battery post is disconnected. Starter button is not engaged/depressed. As far as I can tell all electrical connections appear to be fine and well seated.
During all this, I purchased a new battery. I noticed when the engine turns over it is very slow just like it would be if battery was low, this occured also with jumper cables connected to battery and my truck. Battery has 12.7 volts per meter.
So, to answer your first question: yes. With on/off switch off and neg/ground cable touched to neg battery post engine turns over. Second question: starter issue appears to be in additon to, if in fact it is a problem. Only get 6+ volts at starter when engine turns over. Should be 12+ volts, correct?

Thanks for your help and patience

 

The starter solenoid is supposed to disconnect the battery from the starter motor whenever it is not being *clicked* on through the ignition switch, starter safety interlock wiring, and the starter button. The solenoid is clicked on when 12 volts is applied across the two *small* wires going into the solenoid . Thus if you unplug the connector feeding the solenoid small wires, and the starter still engages when you hook up the battery, then the starter solenoid is bad.

It is really important that all battery voltage measurements be done while the starter motor is turning. So when you measured your battery voltage was it done with the starter motor off, or was it done with the starter motor turning?

Six volts at the starter motor is wrong. But exactly where did you put the meter probes while you did this? Red was on the starter input post? Where was the black lead from the meter? On the starter frame? On the negative battery post?

What I'm wondering is if the battery voltage also collapses to six volts under the heavy current draw from the starter motor. If so that would be one direction to go for further troubleshooting. If the battery stays at 12 volts under heavy load and the starter still is measuring six volts, then that is quite another troubleshooting direction.

 

Thanks alot. I am in the process of getting a new solenoid. In testing the starter, red meter probe was on starter input post and blk probe was on starter frame and it was it done with starter engaged/turning. I did not measure battery voltage while starter motor was turning.
For now I will get new solenoid and see where that takes me and address possible starter issue once new solenoid is in place.
Thanks again for your time.