Bigger Kawasaki Prairies
#2
11-12-1999, 11:35 AM
I feel that Yamaha exceeded the limit for size in the ATV market when they built the Grizzly. From comments made by Grizzly owners, even design changes have not been enough to reduce the heat from this 600cc monster. But then I am sure there are those who would sit atop a V-8 engine if someone built an ATV frame to go around it.
I say 400cc is plenty of machine for those with normal amounts of testosterone. Beyond that and your money would be better spent on something with an air-conditioned cab.
I say 400cc is plenty of machine for those with normal amounts of testosterone. Beyond that and your money would be better spent on something with an air-conditioned cab.
#3
11-12-1999, 12:18 PM
Yes, I agree the Kawasaki desperately needs a new big bore utilo-cruiser, i.e., a combination of utility ATV and sport ATV that is biased towards comfort. It would be the ATV version of Cadillac’s Escalade or Lincoln’s Navigator.
The following post originally appeared over 18 months ago under the old forum format, and was lost when the change to the new forum format occurred this past July. With slight modification, and with further editorial comment appearing in [brackets] to reflect the marketplace changes of the past 18 months, here it is again.
Army Man
/////////////////////////////////////////////////
Thoughts On A 650 Utilo-Cruiser
/////////////////////////////////////////////////
The Kawasaki Bayou 400 4x4 was the undisputed power and performance king of the heavyweight utility 4x4 class when it was introduced six years ago. Today the Bayou, and its spin-off the Prairie, are just two more entries in the now hotly contested middleweight utility 4x4 class. What a difference six years makes. Yesterday’s heavyweights have become today’s middleweights, and today’s heavyweights now displace 500cc and more. Even Suzuki, a company that hadn’t fielded a new machine in ten years, now offers two 500s. (Sorry Honda fans, but the new 450 Foreman, with an actual displacement of only 432cc, is just another middleweight, albeit a muscular one.)
[Last year’s then new Honda Foreman 450 didn’t last long did, did it? It is now set to be replaced by Honda Rubicon 500].
To my mind, what is even more remarkable is that the company that fielded yesterday’s heavyweight champ has no contender in today’s heavyweight arena. WHY??? While you “rope-a-doped” with your 400s, the lead slipped away from you as other companies brought 450s, 500s, and even 600s [and now a 650] to market.
Forget stopgap improvements like automatic transmissions, what sells in today’s marketplace is raw, brute power. You know, like your Vulcan 1500 V-twin cruiser and your 180 mph ZX-11 Ninja sport bike, each one is the biggest and baddest in its respective class. At Kawasaki you ATV guys do talk with the bike guys occasionally, don’t you? No? Well, given their success, it couldn’t hurt.
To help alleviate this apparent dearth of product development ideas within your organization, I hereby present a list of features sure to put the next big Kawasaki back in contention for the heavyweight crown:
Engine: Make it a 650. Don’t waste time fielding a 450, 500, or even a 600. As the only major manufacturer without a heavyweight 4x4 in your product line, go for the gusto. Anything less than a 650 will be viewed as just another “also-ran” in the heavyweight 4x4 race for the gold. While it might be tempting to simply transplant a KLX650 engine into a Bayou/Prairie to save on manufacturing costs by using existing components, I believe that the 100mm x 83mm bore and stoke of the KLX650 is too over-square to produce optimum mid-range torque and horsepower. I suggest that a bore and stroke of 96mm x 90mm be used instead. This would still produce a true 650cc of displacement while maintaining the 1.07-to-1 bore and stroke ratio that works so well in the Bayou and Prairie 400s.
Comment: Honda’s 4mm bore job on the Foreman that boosted displacement from 395 to 432cc was nothing more than a rear-guard action designed to buy time against Polaris and Yamaha (and now Suzuki) until Honda can field their own heavyweight machine. Competition for the quad buyer’s dollar is really heating up. Last year the number of quads sold surpassed the number of bikes sold. And in America where perception is reality, where bigger has always been better, and where there is no such thing as too much power (look no further than Honda’s own streetgoing SR-71, the CBR1100XX Super Blackbird), it seems extremely unlikely that Honda will be willing to spot the competition 150cc in the battle for those coveted dollars for very long.
[Honda didn’t wait long. Just a mere 18 months which is a very short period in the manufacturing world].
Prediction: I predict the current Foreman 400 will be phased out, the Foreman 450 will be Honda’s middleweight entry, and an XR600 based machine will appear in the Honda line up sometime in the next two years. Yes, I hear you say, but a 600 is more like a bloody small tank than a large quad, and who the heck needs one anyway when a little old 300 will do just fine, thank you very much. That may be true for some folks, but consider this; here in the good old USA, the land of wide open spaces, where we have no Autobahn like the Germans, where we have no Autostrada like the Italians, and where the national speed limit was only grudging raised to 65 mph by gracious permission of our masters in Washington (yes, I know some states are at 70 mph and in a very few places there are supposedly no limits), every one of the big four Japanese motorcycle manufacturers offers a 170+ mph street bike for sale, and none has any trouble selling them. Heavyweight quads in the 500 to 650cc range should sell quite well.
[So far I’ve missed the prediction on the XR600 based quad, but I’m not withdrawing it. However, I was right on the money regarding the Foreman 400, it’s gone].
Engine Cooling: Make the new engine liquid cooled. Liquid cooling allows superior temperature regulation as compared to air cooling or air/oil cooling. Engine operating temperature is both lower and more constant. Liquid cooling makes for a quieter engine as it damps the mechanical noise that tends to radiate off the fins of an air cooled engine. Use the double-core radiator from the Bayou, not the single-core radiator from the Prairie, so it can run all day with overheating.
[Note that despite Honda’s penchant for air-cooled quads, the new Rubicon is liquid-cooled].
Engine Starting: The primary starter should be electric. The secondary, or backup, starter should be a kick starter of the type found on the Bayou, NOT a recoil starter as found on the Prairie.
Transmission: I don’t really have a preference. However, you could offer buyers a choice by building two different models, like Honda is currently doing with their Foreman 450. The KLF650A would be the automatic transmission model and the KLF650S would be the standard transmission model. While your KAPS automatic transmission provides a slight amount of compression braking on downhills, it is quite outclassed by Yamaha’s version which uses one-way sprag clutches. Please consider redesigning your KAPS automatic transmission, or consider using a completely different type of automatic transmission such as the Toro-Trak infinitely variable transmission (IVT) invented by the British Technology Group and currently undergoing further development by the Ford Motor Company.
[Honda beat everybody to the punch with the “completely different” transmission. While not an IVT like the Toro-Trak, it still beats the pants off the belt-drive snowmobile “automatics” fielded by everybody else].
Subtransmission: Again, I don’t really have a preference, but why not offer a two-speed subtransmission as an option on these models for those folks who want one. If the engine, transmission, and subtransmission are designed as modular units, such as Triumph does with its 3 and 4 cylinder street bike engines, then having the subtransmission as a dealer installed option should not be terribly difficult.
Drivetrain: Combine the new motor with a longitudinally in-line crankshaft/transmission/clutch/shaft-drive setup a` la the Honda Foreman to reduce weight and power losses. Invent your own version of Suzuki’s SureTrac limited slip differential that directs the power to the wheel that grips not the wheel that slips.
[Note that the Rubicon supposedly has a new front diffrential that overcomes the “wheel in the air spinning” problem. But so did Suzuki, and their’s was no better than what went before, so we’ll see].
Frame: Instead of making the frame from the usual chrome-moly tubing, use the rectangular box-section aluminum frame technology from your Ninja sport bikes to make a quad frame that is strong, rigid, and light weight. A box-section rectangular aluminum space frame will have more interior room than a traditional tube frame with its many gussets and cross-braces. This extra room could be used to reposition existing things and/or provide room for new things.
[While I’ve seen a few custom dune quads that have used street bike engines, wherein they transplanted not only the engine, but the section of box-section aluminum frame that supports the engine, no manufacturer has yet to pick up on this].
Weight: By using an aluminum frame and aluminum wheels it should be possible to keep the vehicle’s wet weight under 650 pounds. Dry weight numbers are almost meaningless. Who do you know that runs any vehicle without gas, oil, and antifreeze? My Bayou’s dry weight is listed as 595 pounds. My Bayou’s wet weight with all fluids topped off is 644 pounds, a difference of more than 8%. Wet weight is the only weight that matters.
[Note that, along with Suzuki’s 500, the new Rubicon also uses aluminum wheels, and it has a claimed dry weight of only 597 lbs. The first test should give us the real full-up wet weight].
Skid Plate: Make the skid plate from 3/16” 6061 aluminum alloy, the perfect mate to the frame previously described, have it cover the entire undercarriage, and secure it with heavy duty bolts and heavy duty mounting tabs. The thin mild steel skid plates on my Bayou have numerous dents after only 470 miles [now 1,250 miles]. The front skid plate has taken hits hard enough to bend the mounting bolts/tabs and move the entire skid plate slightly towards the rear of the machine.
Fenders: The front and rear fenders on the Bayou are great. They provide tremendous protection for the rider. The front fenders on the Prairie are great, but the rear fenders don’t provide quite enough coverage. I really don’t want to get muddy if I can help it. Use the fenders from the Bayou.
Bumper: Put a super heavy duty front bumper on it. One made from 1¼”, or better yet 1½”, diameter 6061 aluminum alloy, or heat treated steel tubing so pushing through dense brush and bulldozing small trees is no problem. Also, the bumper must come setup from the factory to handle an optional electric winch with roller fairlead.
[I really like the “Brute” replacement front bumpers, and wish the manufacturers would pick up on this concept].
Saddle: Both the Bayou and Prairie have excellent saddles that are comfortable and offer good support. Use the saddle from the Prairie as it seems to have a slight comfort edge on the Bayou. But no matter which one you use, make certain it is long enough to permit carrying a passenger. Yes, I know your product liability lawyers frown on this, but the reality of the situation is that we all carry passengers from time to time. If it becomes necessary to carry a buddy back to the trailhead, I WANT the capability to do it with the least amount of inconvenience.
Footpegs/Floorboards: Another item for which I have no real preference. But since the industry trend is to floorboards, use the ones from the Prairie as they allow plenty of room for the passenger’s feet as well as for the driver’s feet.
Suspension: Combine the plush long travel suspension of the Prairie with the semi-independent rear suspension of the Bayou (Quad-Link). While at first glance many might think that semi-independent rear suspension is not state of the art, it nonetheless has several advantages over fully independent rear suspension. It is not as complex as fully independent rear suspension, nor is it as heavy. It is better than fully independent rear suspension at maintaining nearly constant ground clearance and contact, and it excels in negotiating severely uneven terrain while maintaining a nearly even body position. Suzuki put semi-independent rear suspension on their brand new flagship Quadrunner 500 because it works so well, not because they couldn’t build fully independent rear suspension [which they do put on their King Quad]. Finally, add an anti-sway bar to control body roll, and put on first class progressive shocks with the damping adjusted so the machine doesn’t buck and pogo out of control at speeds above 30 mph.
[Note that the Arctic Cat 500 also uses semi-independent rear suspension].
Tires & Wheels: Put decent tires and wheels on it right from the factory. After spending a ton of money to buy a high-end quad, why should I have to spend another small fortune just to put decent tires and wheels on it? The rims on the mild steel wheels supplied with my Bayou were deformed and leaking after a mere 400 miles of semi-aggressive riding (I’m too old and cautious for really aggressive riding). Put 26 or even 27 inch “bigfoot” style tires, 9 inches wide in front and 11 inches wide in back, and Douglas Ultra Red Label .190 cast aluminum wheels [or their equivalent] on right at the factory. The cast aluminum wheels are stronger than their steel counterparts and will reduce unsprung weight because they are lighter. The increased footprint of the larger “bigfoot” style 6-ply tires will provide more traction and better puncture resistance.
[Arctic Cat is the only manufacturer to put decent size tires on right at the factory].
Brakes: The individually controlled dual hydraulic front disc brakes and single mechanical rear drum brake setup on the Bayou/Prairie works very well. The only drawback is the Prairie’s inexplicably exposed rear drum. Use the brake setup from the Bayou where the rear drum is inside the right rear wheel and well protected. Please do not even consider an integrated braking system a` la Polaris.
Fuel Capacity: Fuel capacity should be at least 5 gallons. Use the fuel flow control valve from the Prairie. It is much easier to manipulate than the one on the Bayou. Also, please consider repositioning the fuel tank near the quad’s center of mass. Then, just like the Honda Goldwing touring bike, the “fuel tank” can be used for storage and electrical components. This will also make the quad less likely to tip over.
[Bombardier was the first to reposition the fuel tank with their step-thru frame Traxter].
Electrical System: Put on a 400 watt alternator and a 24 amp-hour battery so that running power hungry accessories like a winch cause no problems. Put at least three accessory outlets on the wiring harness. Put 50 watt headlights on for easy nighttime operation. Offer brake lights as an option. And please put a cigarette-lighter style outlet right on the dashboard.
Instrumentation: Standard instrumentation should consist of a speedometer, odometer, resetable tripmeter, hourmeter, tachometer (I REALLY do want to know how many revs I’m pulling, and many others would like to be sure they are not over reving their machines either), coolant temperature gauge (NOT an idiot light), and fuel gauge. And please don’t make the gauges small and chintzy. Let us have a first class set of gauges comparable to what you routinely put on even entry-level street bikes. I don’t think that is too much to ask from a top-of-the-line quad.
Noise Control: In addition to the noise attenuation afforded by the water jacket around the cylinder, put on a REALLY effective muffler, or mufflers a` la the Honda NX650 dual-sport motorcycle. I hate having to shout over engine/exhaust noise just to talk to my riding partner a mere three feet away. Why is it that the muffler/resonator on my Lincoln Town Car with a volume only 3¼ times greater (835ci vs. 257ci) than that of the muffler on my Bayou can quiet an engine 12½ times larger (5000cc vs. 400cc), and do it more effectively? The muffler on my Lincoln is nothing special. I can walk into any Midas Muffler shop anywhere in the country and buy it off the shelf for less than $30.00. Come on guys, I know you can do better with only a little more effort.
[Kawasaki did pick up on this one. Current advertising for the Prairie indicates it is quieter than last year’s model].
For the curious, the Lincoln’s muffler measures 4x10x18 and its resonator measures 3½x12. Combined volume for the Lincoln’s muffler/resonator is calculated as follows: (4*10*18) + (3.14159*1.75*1.75*12) = 720+115.45 = 835.45. The Bayou’s muffler measures 4.75x14.5 and its volume is calculated as follows: 3.14159*2.375*2.375*14.5 = 256.95. The ratio of the two volumes is 835.45/256.95 = 3.25.
Storage: Increase the size of the storage compartment and make it easier to get into. Access to the Bayou’s storage compartment is horrible. Access to the Prairie’s storage compartment is much better, but still not all that it could be. On Honda’s Pacific Coast touring bike the entire rear section of the bike is hinged and can be raised just like a cars trunk lid to reveal two large storage compartments. Might it not be possible to do something similar with a quad? I believe it is worth a look as there isn’t a quad made that has truly decent and easily accessible storage.
[Bombardier’s Traxter has the best storage compartment in the business].
Model Names: Unfortunately the names Bayou and Prairie completely lack even a modicum of élan or panache, as does the name Foreman. They simply don’t produce the same reaction as Lightning, Mustang, Corsair, Avenger, Helldiver, Hellcat, Wildcat, Thunderbolt, Spitfire, or Hurricane. World War II fighter aircraft one and all, but you get the idea. In fact, you probably felt it just reciting the names. Remember that here in America where perception is reality, and where any association with greatness, no matter how tenuous, is eagerly sought out, e.g., how many people have you seen wearing bomber jackets that have never been any closer to a B-17 or a B-29 than the History Channel, what is needed is a name that immediately evokes the same strong visceral reaction as that of those long gone fighter planes. When Honda unintentionally, or intentionally, lifted the name Blackbird from the world’s fastest production aircraft, the SR-71 designed in Lockheed’s Skunk Works by the legendary Kelly Johnson, they forged an image of unmistakable speed and power for their CBR1100XX. While the name Blackbird does not have quite the cachet as those names attached to the older warbirds, it nonetheless conveys the desired impression. With that in mind, I hereby modestly propose calling the new machine the T-Rex 650, or if you prefer model numbers instead of names, the TR650EX. Either way it’s the baddest, meanest, nastiest mudder this side of the Jurassic. I can see the advertising slogans now... “A Grizzly is just a snack for a T-Rex” and, with apologies to Frito-Lay, “Betcha can’t eat just one”.
None of what I have proposed is new or untried technology. Every bit of it is currently in use somewhere by you or by others. Just like Chrysler, whose advertising slogan for their cab-forward cars is “We’re Changing Everything”, this is your opportunity to rethink the quad from the ground up and create a landmark design that will set the trend for the future. The synergistic effect of these things would yield a super quad sure to be a strong contender for top honors in the heavyweight division. If Kawasaki Heavy Industries Ltd. can build super tankers for the oil industry, and bullet trains for rapid transit, surely they can build super quads if they so choose. Waiting for others to test the waters is a valid initial tactical strategy. It gives one time to analyze the competition’s offerings, probe for weakness, and improve one’s own position. But now that the other manufacturers have laid their cards on the table, it is time to act, and act decisively. Build the 650 super quad that I, and so many others like me, have been waiting for. PLEASE!
Army Man
The following post originally appeared over 18 months ago under the old forum format, and was lost when the change to the new forum format occurred this past July. With slight modification, and with further editorial comment appearing in [brackets] to reflect the marketplace changes of the past 18 months, here it is again.
Army Man
/////////////////////////////////////////////////
Thoughts On A 650 Utilo-Cruiser
/////////////////////////////////////////////////
The Kawasaki Bayou 400 4x4 was the undisputed power and performance king of the heavyweight utility 4x4 class when it was introduced six years ago. Today the Bayou, and its spin-off the Prairie, are just two more entries in the now hotly contested middleweight utility 4x4 class. What a difference six years makes. Yesterday’s heavyweights have become today’s middleweights, and today’s heavyweights now displace 500cc and more. Even Suzuki, a company that hadn’t fielded a new machine in ten years, now offers two 500s. (Sorry Honda fans, but the new 450 Foreman, with an actual displacement of only 432cc, is just another middleweight, albeit a muscular one.)
[Last year’s then new Honda Foreman 450 didn’t last long did, did it? It is now set to be replaced by Honda Rubicon 500].
To my mind, what is even more remarkable is that the company that fielded yesterday’s heavyweight champ has no contender in today’s heavyweight arena. WHY??? While you “rope-a-doped” with your 400s, the lead slipped away from you as other companies brought 450s, 500s, and even 600s [and now a 650] to market.
Forget stopgap improvements like automatic transmissions, what sells in today’s marketplace is raw, brute power. You know, like your Vulcan 1500 V-twin cruiser and your 180 mph ZX-11 Ninja sport bike, each one is the biggest and baddest in its respective class. At Kawasaki you ATV guys do talk with the bike guys occasionally, don’t you? No? Well, given their success, it couldn’t hurt.
To help alleviate this apparent dearth of product development ideas within your organization, I hereby present a list of features sure to put the next big Kawasaki back in contention for the heavyweight crown:
Engine: Make it a 650. Don’t waste time fielding a 450, 500, or even a 600. As the only major manufacturer without a heavyweight 4x4 in your product line, go for the gusto. Anything less than a 650 will be viewed as just another “also-ran” in the heavyweight 4x4 race for the gold. While it might be tempting to simply transplant a KLX650 engine into a Bayou/Prairie to save on manufacturing costs by using existing components, I believe that the 100mm x 83mm bore and stoke of the KLX650 is too over-square to produce optimum mid-range torque and horsepower. I suggest that a bore and stroke of 96mm x 90mm be used instead. This would still produce a true 650cc of displacement while maintaining the 1.07-to-1 bore and stroke ratio that works so well in the Bayou and Prairie 400s.
Comment: Honda’s 4mm bore job on the Foreman that boosted displacement from 395 to 432cc was nothing more than a rear-guard action designed to buy time against Polaris and Yamaha (and now Suzuki) until Honda can field their own heavyweight machine. Competition for the quad buyer’s dollar is really heating up. Last year the number of quads sold surpassed the number of bikes sold. And in America where perception is reality, where bigger has always been better, and where there is no such thing as too much power (look no further than Honda’s own streetgoing SR-71, the CBR1100XX Super Blackbird), it seems extremely unlikely that Honda will be willing to spot the competition 150cc in the battle for those coveted dollars for very long.
[Honda didn’t wait long. Just a mere 18 months which is a very short period in the manufacturing world].
Prediction: I predict the current Foreman 400 will be phased out, the Foreman 450 will be Honda’s middleweight entry, and an XR600 based machine will appear in the Honda line up sometime in the next two years. Yes, I hear you say, but a 600 is more like a bloody small tank than a large quad, and who the heck needs one anyway when a little old 300 will do just fine, thank you very much. That may be true for some folks, but consider this; here in the good old USA, the land of wide open spaces, where we have no Autobahn like the Germans, where we have no Autostrada like the Italians, and where the national speed limit was only grudging raised to 65 mph by gracious permission of our masters in Washington (yes, I know some states are at 70 mph and in a very few places there are supposedly no limits), every one of the big four Japanese motorcycle manufacturers offers a 170+ mph street bike for sale, and none has any trouble selling them. Heavyweight quads in the 500 to 650cc range should sell quite well.
[So far I’ve missed the prediction on the XR600 based quad, but I’m not withdrawing it. However, I was right on the money regarding the Foreman 400, it’s gone].
Engine Cooling: Make the new engine liquid cooled. Liquid cooling allows superior temperature regulation as compared to air cooling or air/oil cooling. Engine operating temperature is both lower and more constant. Liquid cooling makes for a quieter engine as it damps the mechanical noise that tends to radiate off the fins of an air cooled engine. Use the double-core radiator from the Bayou, not the single-core radiator from the Prairie, so it can run all day with overheating.
[Note that despite Honda’s penchant for air-cooled quads, the new Rubicon is liquid-cooled].
Engine Starting: The primary starter should be electric. The secondary, or backup, starter should be a kick starter of the type found on the Bayou, NOT a recoil starter as found on the Prairie.
Transmission: I don’t really have a preference. However, you could offer buyers a choice by building two different models, like Honda is currently doing with their Foreman 450. The KLF650A would be the automatic transmission model and the KLF650S would be the standard transmission model. While your KAPS automatic transmission provides a slight amount of compression braking on downhills, it is quite outclassed by Yamaha’s version which uses one-way sprag clutches. Please consider redesigning your KAPS automatic transmission, or consider using a completely different type of automatic transmission such as the Toro-Trak infinitely variable transmission (IVT) invented by the British Technology Group and currently undergoing further development by the Ford Motor Company.
[Honda beat everybody to the punch with the “completely different” transmission. While not an IVT like the Toro-Trak, it still beats the pants off the belt-drive snowmobile “automatics” fielded by everybody else].
Subtransmission: Again, I don’t really have a preference, but why not offer a two-speed subtransmission as an option on these models for those folks who want one. If the engine, transmission, and subtransmission are designed as modular units, such as Triumph does with its 3 and 4 cylinder street bike engines, then having the subtransmission as a dealer installed option should not be terribly difficult.
Drivetrain: Combine the new motor with a longitudinally in-line crankshaft/transmission/clutch/shaft-drive setup a` la the Honda Foreman to reduce weight and power losses. Invent your own version of Suzuki’s SureTrac limited slip differential that directs the power to the wheel that grips not the wheel that slips.
[Note that the Rubicon supposedly has a new front diffrential that overcomes the “wheel in the air spinning” problem. But so did Suzuki, and their’s was no better than what went before, so we’ll see].
Frame: Instead of making the frame from the usual chrome-moly tubing, use the rectangular box-section aluminum frame technology from your Ninja sport bikes to make a quad frame that is strong, rigid, and light weight. A box-section rectangular aluminum space frame will have more interior room than a traditional tube frame with its many gussets and cross-braces. This extra room could be used to reposition existing things and/or provide room for new things.
[While I’ve seen a few custom dune quads that have used street bike engines, wherein they transplanted not only the engine, but the section of box-section aluminum frame that supports the engine, no manufacturer has yet to pick up on this].
Weight: By using an aluminum frame and aluminum wheels it should be possible to keep the vehicle’s wet weight under 650 pounds. Dry weight numbers are almost meaningless. Who do you know that runs any vehicle without gas, oil, and antifreeze? My Bayou’s dry weight is listed as 595 pounds. My Bayou’s wet weight with all fluids topped off is 644 pounds, a difference of more than 8%. Wet weight is the only weight that matters.
[Note that, along with Suzuki’s 500, the new Rubicon also uses aluminum wheels, and it has a claimed dry weight of only 597 lbs. The first test should give us the real full-up wet weight].
Skid Plate: Make the skid plate from 3/16” 6061 aluminum alloy, the perfect mate to the frame previously described, have it cover the entire undercarriage, and secure it with heavy duty bolts and heavy duty mounting tabs. The thin mild steel skid plates on my Bayou have numerous dents after only 470 miles [now 1,250 miles]. The front skid plate has taken hits hard enough to bend the mounting bolts/tabs and move the entire skid plate slightly towards the rear of the machine.
Fenders: The front and rear fenders on the Bayou are great. They provide tremendous protection for the rider. The front fenders on the Prairie are great, but the rear fenders don’t provide quite enough coverage. I really don’t want to get muddy if I can help it. Use the fenders from the Bayou.
Bumper: Put a super heavy duty front bumper on it. One made from 1¼”, or better yet 1½”, diameter 6061 aluminum alloy, or heat treated steel tubing so pushing through dense brush and bulldozing small trees is no problem. Also, the bumper must come setup from the factory to handle an optional electric winch with roller fairlead.
[I really like the “Brute” replacement front bumpers, and wish the manufacturers would pick up on this concept].
Saddle: Both the Bayou and Prairie have excellent saddles that are comfortable and offer good support. Use the saddle from the Prairie as it seems to have a slight comfort edge on the Bayou. But no matter which one you use, make certain it is long enough to permit carrying a passenger. Yes, I know your product liability lawyers frown on this, but the reality of the situation is that we all carry passengers from time to time. If it becomes necessary to carry a buddy back to the trailhead, I WANT the capability to do it with the least amount of inconvenience.
Footpegs/Floorboards: Another item for which I have no real preference. But since the industry trend is to floorboards, use the ones from the Prairie as they allow plenty of room for the passenger’s feet as well as for the driver’s feet.
Suspension: Combine the plush long travel suspension of the Prairie with the semi-independent rear suspension of the Bayou (Quad-Link). While at first glance many might think that semi-independent rear suspension is not state of the art, it nonetheless has several advantages over fully independent rear suspension. It is not as complex as fully independent rear suspension, nor is it as heavy. It is better than fully independent rear suspension at maintaining nearly constant ground clearance and contact, and it excels in negotiating severely uneven terrain while maintaining a nearly even body position. Suzuki put semi-independent rear suspension on their brand new flagship Quadrunner 500 because it works so well, not because they couldn’t build fully independent rear suspension [which they do put on their King Quad]. Finally, add an anti-sway bar to control body roll, and put on first class progressive shocks with the damping adjusted so the machine doesn’t buck and pogo out of control at speeds above 30 mph.
[Note that the Arctic Cat 500 also uses semi-independent rear suspension].
Tires & Wheels: Put decent tires and wheels on it right from the factory. After spending a ton of money to buy a high-end quad, why should I have to spend another small fortune just to put decent tires and wheels on it? The rims on the mild steel wheels supplied with my Bayou were deformed and leaking after a mere 400 miles of semi-aggressive riding (I’m too old and cautious for really aggressive riding). Put 26 or even 27 inch “bigfoot” style tires, 9 inches wide in front and 11 inches wide in back, and Douglas Ultra Red Label .190 cast aluminum wheels [or their equivalent] on right at the factory. The cast aluminum wheels are stronger than their steel counterparts and will reduce unsprung weight because they are lighter. The increased footprint of the larger “bigfoot” style 6-ply tires will provide more traction and better puncture resistance.
[Arctic Cat is the only manufacturer to put decent size tires on right at the factory].
Brakes: The individually controlled dual hydraulic front disc brakes and single mechanical rear drum brake setup on the Bayou/Prairie works very well. The only drawback is the Prairie’s inexplicably exposed rear drum. Use the brake setup from the Bayou where the rear drum is inside the right rear wheel and well protected. Please do not even consider an integrated braking system a` la Polaris.
Fuel Capacity: Fuel capacity should be at least 5 gallons. Use the fuel flow control valve from the Prairie. It is much easier to manipulate than the one on the Bayou. Also, please consider repositioning the fuel tank near the quad’s center of mass. Then, just like the Honda Goldwing touring bike, the “fuel tank” can be used for storage and electrical components. This will also make the quad less likely to tip over.
[Bombardier was the first to reposition the fuel tank with their step-thru frame Traxter].
Electrical System: Put on a 400 watt alternator and a 24 amp-hour battery so that running power hungry accessories like a winch cause no problems. Put at least three accessory outlets on the wiring harness. Put 50 watt headlights on for easy nighttime operation. Offer brake lights as an option. And please put a cigarette-lighter style outlet right on the dashboard.
Instrumentation: Standard instrumentation should consist of a speedometer, odometer, resetable tripmeter, hourmeter, tachometer (I REALLY do want to know how many revs I’m pulling, and many others would like to be sure they are not over reving their machines either), coolant temperature gauge (NOT an idiot light), and fuel gauge. And please don’t make the gauges small and chintzy. Let us have a first class set of gauges comparable to what you routinely put on even entry-level street bikes. I don’t think that is too much to ask from a top-of-the-line quad.
Noise Control: In addition to the noise attenuation afforded by the water jacket around the cylinder, put on a REALLY effective muffler, or mufflers a` la the Honda NX650 dual-sport motorcycle. I hate having to shout over engine/exhaust noise just to talk to my riding partner a mere three feet away. Why is it that the muffler/resonator on my Lincoln Town Car with a volume only 3¼ times greater (835ci vs. 257ci) than that of the muffler on my Bayou can quiet an engine 12½ times larger (5000cc vs. 400cc), and do it more effectively? The muffler on my Lincoln is nothing special. I can walk into any Midas Muffler shop anywhere in the country and buy it off the shelf for less than $30.00. Come on guys, I know you can do better with only a little more effort.
[Kawasaki did pick up on this one. Current advertising for the Prairie indicates it is quieter than last year’s model].
For the curious, the Lincoln’s muffler measures 4x10x18 and its resonator measures 3½x12. Combined volume for the Lincoln’s muffler/resonator is calculated as follows: (4*10*18) + (3.14159*1.75*1.75*12) = 720+115.45 = 835.45. The Bayou’s muffler measures 4.75x14.5 and its volume is calculated as follows: 3.14159*2.375*2.375*14.5 = 256.95. The ratio of the two volumes is 835.45/256.95 = 3.25.
Storage: Increase the size of the storage compartment and make it easier to get into. Access to the Bayou’s storage compartment is horrible. Access to the Prairie’s storage compartment is much better, but still not all that it could be. On Honda’s Pacific Coast touring bike the entire rear section of the bike is hinged and can be raised just like a cars trunk lid to reveal two large storage compartments. Might it not be possible to do something similar with a quad? I believe it is worth a look as there isn’t a quad made that has truly decent and easily accessible storage.
[Bombardier’s Traxter has the best storage compartment in the business].
Model Names: Unfortunately the names Bayou and Prairie completely lack even a modicum of élan or panache, as does the name Foreman. They simply don’t produce the same reaction as Lightning, Mustang, Corsair, Avenger, Helldiver, Hellcat, Wildcat, Thunderbolt, Spitfire, or Hurricane. World War II fighter aircraft one and all, but you get the idea. In fact, you probably felt it just reciting the names. Remember that here in America where perception is reality, and where any association with greatness, no matter how tenuous, is eagerly sought out, e.g., how many people have you seen wearing bomber jackets that have never been any closer to a B-17 or a B-29 than the History Channel, what is needed is a name that immediately evokes the same strong visceral reaction as that of those long gone fighter planes. When Honda unintentionally, or intentionally, lifted the name Blackbird from the world’s fastest production aircraft, the SR-71 designed in Lockheed’s Skunk Works by the legendary Kelly Johnson, they forged an image of unmistakable speed and power for their CBR1100XX. While the name Blackbird does not have quite the cachet as those names attached to the older warbirds, it nonetheless conveys the desired impression. With that in mind, I hereby modestly propose calling the new machine the T-Rex 650, or if you prefer model numbers instead of names, the TR650EX. Either way it’s the baddest, meanest, nastiest mudder this side of the Jurassic. I can see the advertising slogans now... “A Grizzly is just a snack for a T-Rex” and, with apologies to Frito-Lay, “Betcha can’t eat just one”.
None of what I have proposed is new or untried technology. Every bit of it is currently in use somewhere by you or by others. Just like Chrysler, whose advertising slogan for their cab-forward cars is “We’re Changing Everything”, this is your opportunity to rethink the quad from the ground up and create a landmark design that will set the trend for the future. The synergistic effect of these things would yield a super quad sure to be a strong contender for top honors in the heavyweight division. If Kawasaki Heavy Industries Ltd. can build super tankers for the oil industry, and bullet trains for rapid transit, surely they can build super quads if they so choose. Waiting for others to test the waters is a valid initial tactical strategy. It gives one time to analyze the competition’s offerings, probe for weakness, and improve one’s own position. But now that the other manufacturers have laid their cards on the table, it is time to act, and act decisively. Build the 650 super quad that I, and so many others like me, have been waiting for. PLEASE!
Army Man
#5
11-12-1999, 07:33 PM
Jim.....
B R A V O!
Have you sent a copy of this to Kaw by any chance??? I think they could stand to read it. It would be awesome. I'd hate to have to pay $15,000 as well - but a man's got to do, what a man's got to do.
I'll keep my fingers crossed.
Happy Trails
------------------
Steve "Bog Hog" West
Honda 300 4x4 - Gordonized, Powered and Vamped
B R A V O!
Have you sent a copy of this to Kaw by any chance??? I think they could stand to read it. It would be awesome. I'd hate to have to pay $15,000 as well - but a man's got to do, what a man's got to do.
I'll keep my fingers crossed.
Happy Trails
------------------
Steve "Bog Hog" West
Honda 300 4x4 - Gordonized, Powered and Vamped
#6
11-15-1999, 10:45 AM
Chris & Steve,
I can’t believe you guys are going to stick a pin in my balloon over a little thing like money! Sheeesh, you’d think I was asking for the Moon! I’ll bet Kawasaki could build my 650 Super Bayou/Prairie for under $8 grand.
And yes Steve, I did write to Kawasaki about my idea for a 650. In fact, I wrote them three different times about it.
I first wrote them over 4 years ago on 21 Sept. ’95, long before any of the first 500+cc heavyweight quads were even rumored. I received no response.
I wrote them again on 25 Apr. ’96 after Arctic Cat and Polaris both released their 500s. Again, I received no response.
I wrote them again on 9 Feb. ’98 after Honda bumped their Foreman from 400cc to 450cc and Suzuki released their 500. This time I specifically request the courtesy of a reply. The following is a direct quote from my letter:
“Please see that the ATV product development group manager receives a copy of this letter. Also, if it is not too much trouble, please acknowledge that you received this letter. At the very least it would be nice to know somebody took the time to read it.”
This time I did receive a reply back acknowledging receipt of my letter and complementing me on the great number of highly detailed ideas I had provided. Two months later on 4 Apr. ‘98 I ran into Kawasaki’s ATV Product Development Manager, Jim Williams, at the AHPA Poker Run in Cochranton, PA. In the course of conversation, I asked him whether or not he had seen my letter. He indicated it had come across his desk and he had read it, but that Kawasaki had no immediate plans to produce a heavyweight 4x4.
Over four years ago the biggest 4x4 you could buy was a 400. When 4 Wheel Action tested a group of 300cc 4x4s in the August ’96 issue, they asked the following question in reference to the first appearance of the Polaris Sportsman 500, the Arctic Cat 454, and the rest of the 400cc 4x4s:
“Wait a minute! Does everyone need that much displacement? Does everyone want a machine that weighs around 30 pounds more? Does everyone have an additional $800 to spend just to get more displacement?”
Well apparently a lot more people did want all of this and had the buck$ to pay for it than anyone thought, including the ATV press. In my first letter to Kawasaki on 21 Sept. ’95, nearly 10 months prior to 4WA editors making the above quote, I said the following in summing up my 4x4 wish list:
“This brings me to my final thought... why doesn’t Kawasaki create an entirely new category of super quads? The competition is thinking 500ccs. Skip the 500cc class and go straight to 650cc.”
It is personally frustrating to me that I correctly called the market move to heavyweight 4x4s long before anyone else went on record with that kind of prediction, and it is disappointing that Kawasaki failed to act on that prediction.
Now that Honda has introduced their Rubicon 500, Kawasaki is the only manufacturer not to offer a 500+cc heavyweight 4x4. So I suppose I should send this letter to Kawasaki for a fourth time, but I’m starting to lose hope that it will do any good. Because, unfortunately at this point, any new heavyweight 4x4 fielded by Kawasaki had better be a 650, and it had better be really unique and innovative, or it will tend to be viewed by the quad-buying public as little more than a “me too” effort.
So yes, I wrote Kawasaki with a prediction that would have been the envy of Edgar Cayce and Jeanne Dixon combined. And what did we get? We got the Prairie 300, Kawasaki has dropped the Bayou 400 for 2000, and there still is not even a rumor of the heavyweight quad I first suggested they build four years ago.
Until the appearance of Honda’s Rubicon 500, none of the other heavyweight 4x4s were sufficiently close to my criteria to really spark my interest. But the Rubicon is quite exciting and I’m anxiously awaiting the results of the first magazine tests. Kawasaki had better get their thumb back on the pulse of the market soon, because the Rubicon could easily tempt me to switch my allegiance.
Army Man
I can’t believe you guys are going to stick a pin in my balloon over a little thing like money! Sheeesh, you’d think I was asking for the Moon! I’ll bet Kawasaki could build my 650 Super Bayou/Prairie for under $8 grand.
And yes Steve, I did write to Kawasaki about my idea for a 650. In fact, I wrote them three different times about it.
I first wrote them over 4 years ago on 21 Sept. ’95, long before any of the first 500+cc heavyweight quads were even rumored. I received no response.
I wrote them again on 25 Apr. ’96 after Arctic Cat and Polaris both released their 500s. Again, I received no response.
I wrote them again on 9 Feb. ’98 after Honda bumped their Foreman from 400cc to 450cc and Suzuki released their 500. This time I specifically request the courtesy of a reply. The following is a direct quote from my letter:
“Please see that the ATV product development group manager receives a copy of this letter. Also, if it is not too much trouble, please acknowledge that you received this letter. At the very least it would be nice to know somebody took the time to read it.”
This time I did receive a reply back acknowledging receipt of my letter and complementing me on the great number of highly detailed ideas I had provided. Two months later on 4 Apr. ‘98 I ran into Kawasaki’s ATV Product Development Manager, Jim Williams, at the AHPA Poker Run in Cochranton, PA. In the course of conversation, I asked him whether or not he had seen my letter. He indicated it had come across his desk and he had read it, but that Kawasaki had no immediate plans to produce a heavyweight 4x4.
Over four years ago the biggest 4x4 you could buy was a 400. When 4 Wheel Action tested a group of 300cc 4x4s in the August ’96 issue, they asked the following question in reference to the first appearance of the Polaris Sportsman 500, the Arctic Cat 454, and the rest of the 400cc 4x4s:
“Wait a minute! Does everyone need that much displacement? Does everyone want a machine that weighs around 30 pounds more? Does everyone have an additional $800 to spend just to get more displacement?”
Well apparently a lot more people did want all of this and had the buck$ to pay for it than anyone thought, including the ATV press. In my first letter to Kawasaki on 21 Sept. ’95, nearly 10 months prior to 4WA editors making the above quote, I said the following in summing up my 4x4 wish list:
“This brings me to my final thought... why doesn’t Kawasaki create an entirely new category of super quads? The competition is thinking 500ccs. Skip the 500cc class and go straight to 650cc.”
It is personally frustrating to me that I correctly called the market move to heavyweight 4x4s long before anyone else went on record with that kind of prediction, and it is disappointing that Kawasaki failed to act on that prediction.
Now that Honda has introduced their Rubicon 500, Kawasaki is the only manufacturer not to offer a 500+cc heavyweight 4x4. So I suppose I should send this letter to Kawasaki for a fourth time, but I’m starting to lose hope that it will do any good. Because, unfortunately at this point, any new heavyweight 4x4 fielded by Kawasaki had better be a 650, and it had better be really unique and innovative, or it will tend to be viewed by the quad-buying public as little more than a “me too” effort.
So yes, I wrote Kawasaki with a prediction that would have been the envy of Edgar Cayce and Jeanne Dixon combined. And what did we get? We got the Prairie 300, Kawasaki has dropped the Bayou 400 for 2000, and there still is not even a rumor of the heavyweight quad I first suggested they build four years ago.
Until the appearance of Honda’s Rubicon 500, none of the other heavyweight 4x4s were sufficiently close to my criteria to really spark my interest. But the Rubicon is quite exciting and I’m anxiously awaiting the results of the first magazine tests. Kawasaki had better get their thumb back on the pulse of the market soon, because the Rubicon could easily tempt me to switch my allegiance.
Army Man
#7
11-16-1999, 03:50 PM
They're definitely going to have to come up with at least a 500 Prairie if they want to keep in the market. I ride with a couple AC 500's, a Magnum 500 and assorted 400's, I don't get left behind (I'm lighter) but if I buy a new machine in the next couple years, I'll definitely be looking for a 500+ cc machine.
There's no reason why it should be much more $$$ or lbs than a 400 either. The manufacturers just rip us off because they can get more bucks for a bigger engine, even if the parts are the same and the chassis is the same.
When I bought a 98 Chev PU, the 350 was $650 more than a 305. What BS!! same motor, bigger pistons, but GM knows they'll get the $650 from me and just about everyone else, so they do it.
I'd like to see a 500-550cc Prairie with a disk brake on the rear, an improved engine braking system like the Kodiak and Polaris, and a 2wd switch. If not, I'll be riding another brand when I upgrade (3800 miles now)
Raul
There's no reason why it should be much more $$$ or lbs than a 400 either. The manufacturers just rip us off because they can get more bucks for a bigger engine, even if the parts are the same and the chassis is the same.
When I bought a 98 Chev PU, the 350 was $650 more than a 305. What BS!! same motor, bigger pistons, but GM knows they'll get the $650 from me and just about everyone else, so they do it.
I'd like to see a 500-550cc Prairie with a disk brake on the rear, an improved engine braking system like the Kodiak and Polaris, and a 2wd switch. If not, I'll be riding another brand when I upgrade (3800 miles now)
Raul
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