My friend wouldnt shut up about how he rode a praire when they first came out. I didnt like how it was auto when he was tellin me about it i mean a sporty 4x4. But when i rode it it was awsome i cant explain it was kewl. So i guess u really cant juge it till you ride one but i do like the raptor.

 

So much for the friendly 4-wheeling community. Major bad juju in this room.


Back to engine basics from MC engines, similar displacement does not mean similar (ultimate) performance. A single, V-twin, inline 4 - all have different characteristics based on the way the engine fires. An (stock) inline four of 600cc is easisly capable of over 100hp. A v-twin of similar size will get about 60hp, but will have a significantly higher torque percentage throughout the powerband. The v-twin can be modded for more hp, but will never equal the inline 4 with equal mods. This is because of 2 things. In laymans terms HP is built by engine speed. An inline 4 has small bores, but revs to 14k+ rpm. So it has lots and lots of little tiny explosions happening in quick succession, each little explosions pushes the piston a little faster, creating more ultimate energy (HP). But the little explosions don't do a lot to get the bike moving off the line. A v-twin has bores twice as large as the 4. This makes bigger explosions in the cylinder (torque) and lots of grunt. But the explosions happen 1/2 as often as the 4 and that limits it HP potential, especially if the engine is limited to 6000 rpm. If the engine is allowed (and capable) of reving to 14k+ rpm, the HP will climb substantially. Unfortunately few v-twins are capable of revving anywhere close to 14k. This is partly due to the increased rotating mass of each piston combined with the relative instability of a v-twin firing order which cannot be as well balanced as the inline 4. Ultimately the inline 4 has more potential for HP than the V-twin regardless of manufacturer. Similarly a v-twin has more ultimate potential than a single. It's basic engine physics, and cannot be changed, regardless of what bike you ride, or what you've heard about bikes you haven't ridden.

But you also have to factor in the power to weight ratio of any 2 given bikes. A lower power engine in a lighter bike could easily eat a higher power engine in a heavier bike. The heavier bike is going to have to make significantly more power to overcome the weight difference. And anyone familiar with the law of dimenishing returns knows that it takes a LOT of power to take off a little time.

This is not an attack on any person or any bike, this is just the basics. Personally I have a prairie, a good friend has a raptor, and another has a DS. I've ridden all, but never a V-force. Of the 3 I have access to I like mine for it's all purpose use and good sport ability. If I had to choose between the DS and raptor, I'd buy the raptor since it's a better ride even tho' the DS is faster. The DS is too squirrley for my tastes. If I get a chance on a Vforce I might change my mind, but I have no experience with them.

Lastly you cannot judge a line of bikes based on whether or not you beat one on your bike. There are too many variables, state of tune, mods, and mostly the rider's experience. My buddy w/the DS and I used to have the same model streetbike. In any drag race I would beat him by 1/2 the distance. Everytime, period. Then I found out he was shifting at 8k and I was shifting at just over 14k. He had no experience drag racing and didn't know better. I corrected him and then he hung with me. I still won, but he was right there.

 

Cheers AJ,..... Cheers.

 

I Never put down anyone else's Quad. I Love them all. Wish I could have one of each. I even talked my buddy's kid into going down and getting a Predator. I felt it would fit his riding style and skill level better than a KFX700 or 400 which is what I own. With that said, I don't see how we can all sit here and debate the Future that we do NOT Know. We have a pretty good idea of what a Raptor or a DS is capable of and how they can be modified. They are both Very impressive. We have NO idea what the KFX700 is capable of until the same time and energy has been put into it to see how far it can be taken. I'm not willing to say that it is the Stop-All Quad of the century, but on the same hand, I'm amazed how everyone has already determined it's fate. Maybe it is Fear, I don't know. If we are going to compare them to see which one is the baddest of the bad, we simply need to wait and see what the KFX700 is capable of. Comparing Highly Modded Quads to a STOCK Quad is a bit Ridicules.

I couldn't agree more with AJ650. It's Engine Basics 101. One point that he made was the ability of the V-Twin motor to produce large amounts of Torque. Right off the showroom floor, the V-Force makes more Torque than any other Sport Quad on the market today. Let me remind everyone, that Torque is what gets you moving, Not HP.

As far as the KFX700 not being a good MX Quad. DUH!!! It was NEVER intended to be, so Big Surprise. Can it be made better? Yes it can. In fact, in the newest issue of Dirt Wheels,Doug Roll and Scott Wright of IMS, did a major overhaul of the V-Force's suspension, giving it a lower stance, and increased the front shock travel from Stock 9.2 inches to 10.5 inches with Elka Shocks (Remote reservoirs and triple rate springs and have adj. pre-load and compression dampening). On the rear it went from 7.9 inches to a full 10 inches of travel (Dual rate springs and have compression, rebound and pre-load adj.). Surely that should help?

All the Chest Beating and Posturing is great and very entertaining, but it doesn't prove a thing and unless one of you has an inside with Miss Cleo, the future of the KFX700 and it's potential is yet to come. Talk is cheap, "IF" and "WHEN" the 700 owners start discovering it's potential and "IF" and "WHEN" it starts cleaning house, how many of you Big talkers are MAN enough to say you were WRONG?

I know I Can. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

 

Thanx shane. Im glad ur happy with the tires man. Lemme know if u need anything else. Oh and ill mention it to the boss. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

 

Just wait for the modded Vs to come out then u all will see what we alredy know.

 

OK here is what i think on the whole drag race fad that has swept these forums.


Am i the only one that doesnt think that drag racing is what makes a quad great? You can pull a top fuel dragster up beside a Ferrari F50 and drag race and the Ferrari would get smoked every time but that doesnt mean that you would take the top fuel dragster home rather than the ferrari. I mean top speed is only a small piece in a huge puzzle that makes a quad great. THere is only a few words that can be said for the highest top speed. UHGG it just makes me so disgusted.

 

5000 aftermarket parts out for a Raptor and I can't even get a K&N for my V-Force, but you want to race one. That's really impressive.

 

Buy a new RAPPY and buy a new V-FORCE, then sell each. V-FORCE will have better resale-Why do you think that is? V-FORCE is a better all around quad.

 

I don't know how these threads get so far off subject. A week or so ago I posted a message stating there were several raptors in my area wanting to race. I practiced on hole shot for a few days and challenged one of the more experienced raptor riders, then simply posted the results. I did choose the title "Piped raptor......first victim", which is the truth. My first race on my V-Force and I gave you the results.......that's all. Two similar riders...... 400ft......... one winner........ twice. I am not bashing the raptor. I will race more raptors...... there's no shortage around here; at least 4 in my neighborhood. I will post accurate results. If they beat me, I will tell you. This is still the Kawasaki forum isn't it?[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]