Howard Dean wants to ban atv riding?
Feb 17, 2004 | 04:19 PM
#1
Thread Starter
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Trailblazer
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 58
Likes: 0
Howard Dean wants to ban atv riding?
got this from another forum...
"As unsavory is it may be to many of us, it's my experience that it
really does matter that we as riders participate in politics. So as we
move toward November 2004, it is important to ask any given local or
national candidate how pro- or anti-OHV he or she is.
That said, I will always steer clear of telling you how to think, but
please do consider the following evidence and make your own decisions:
On former VT Governor, Dr. Howard Dean, Democratic nomination contestant
for Pres.-`04, VT OHV advocate Todd Sheinfeld had this to say:
"...I had several conversations with Howard Dean over the years, one on
[VT radio program] Switchboard many years ago. In that exchange, the
former Governor expressed to me that he did not like, nor see any use
for, ATVs and the fact that they are not allowed on public land in VT
(whether federal or state) was a great accomplishment. He further told
me that if he, as Governor, could outlaw ATV use on private land he
would do it in a second..."
[From Todd's article at
http://www.vtvasa.org/sitebuildercon...otruenorth.pdf
Todd also directs us to the very telling paragraph copied below from the
"LA Weekly." (Full article: "The Doctor is In: Rolling with
people-powered Howard Dean..." see
http://www.laweekly.com/ink/03/41/features-wolf.php
[On the recent "preservation" in Vermont of 133,000 acres of the former
Champion Paper Company lands, Jamie Wolf wrote:]
"[Dean] and his team used the NRA, he says, to neutralize the most
ardent property-rights Republicans in the legislature. They then went to
the snowmobilers and explained that although there would be a wilderness
area off-limits to them, there would be other areas they could utilize.
They used that concession, he goes on, to get the snowmobilers' help in
supporting the exclusion of ATVs: "You can't compromise with ATVers
under any circumstances, they just do too much damage to the land..." In
other words, Dean says, you assemble the broadest coalition possible and
then parcel out something for everybody. "Now, it can't be everybody,
because there's always those on the extreme edge of the right who want
to clear-cut everything, that's their idea of sustainable timbering..."
But in general, he says, you work with all the stakeholders, and then if
one element of the coalition starts to defect, if the snowmobilers, say,
try to link up with the ATVers, which they sometimes threaten to do,
"you put the leverage on. You say, 'If it's a choice between letting the
ATVs in or keeping the snowmobile people out - sorry, we'll see you
later.' And that brings the snowmobilers back to the table..."
i just have one thing to say... LMAO@ anyone telling me what i can and cant do on my own land!
"As unsavory is it may be to many of us, it's my experience that it
really does matter that we as riders participate in politics. So as we
move toward November 2004, it is important to ask any given local or
national candidate how pro- or anti-OHV he or she is.
That said, I will always steer clear of telling you how to think, but
please do consider the following evidence and make your own decisions:
On former VT Governor, Dr. Howard Dean, Democratic nomination contestant
for Pres.-`04, VT OHV advocate Todd Sheinfeld had this to say:
"...I had several conversations with Howard Dean over the years, one on
[VT radio program] Switchboard many years ago. In that exchange, the
former Governor expressed to me that he did not like, nor see any use
for, ATVs and the fact that they are not allowed on public land in VT
(whether federal or state) was a great accomplishment. He further told
me that if he, as Governor, could outlaw ATV use on private land he
would do it in a second..."
[From Todd's article at
http://www.vtvasa.org/sitebuildercon...otruenorth.pdf
Todd also directs us to the very telling paragraph copied below from the
"LA Weekly." (Full article: "The Doctor is In: Rolling with
people-powered Howard Dean..." see
http://www.laweekly.com/ink/03/41/features-wolf.php
[On the recent "preservation" in Vermont of 133,000 acres of the former
Champion Paper Company lands, Jamie Wolf wrote:]
"[Dean] and his team used the NRA, he says, to neutralize the most
ardent property-rights Republicans in the legislature. They then went to
the snowmobilers and explained that although there would be a wilderness
area off-limits to them, there would be other areas they could utilize.
They used that concession, he goes on, to get the snowmobilers' help in
supporting the exclusion of ATVs: "You can't compromise with ATVers
under any circumstances, they just do too much damage to the land..." In
other words, Dean says, you assemble the broadest coalition possible and
then parcel out something for everybody. "Now, it can't be everybody,
because there's always those on the extreme edge of the right who want
to clear-cut everything, that's their idea of sustainable timbering..."
But in general, he says, you work with all the stakeholders, and then if
one element of the coalition starts to defect, if the snowmobilers, say,
try to link up with the ATVers, which they sometimes threaten to do,
"you put the leverage on. You say, 'If it's a choice between letting the
ATVs in or keeping the snowmobile people out - sorry, we'll see you
later.' And that brings the snowmobilers back to the table..."
i just have one thing to say... LMAO@ anyone telling me what i can and cant do on my own land!
Feb 17, 2004 | 05:22 PM
#3
Trailblazer
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 69
Likes: 0
Howard Dean wants to ban atv riding?
Does anyone know where John Kerry stands on this issue. I dont think Howard Dean has a shot at getting the Democratic nomination. I dont think either can beat Bush or I hope not anyway. But I think Kerry can give him a run. Just my opinion.
Feb 17, 2004 | 07:27 PM
#7
Pro Rider
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 1,114
Likes: 0
Howard Dean wants to ban atv riding?
I don't mean to sound condescending but don't you guys think you are a little behind? We have been debating this issue for the last six months with several threads over five pages long. I was just curious why you have waited till now when its all but over with kerry receiving the nomination to bring this up...
Just curious. For more information on this subject and several good viewpoints, check out this thread.
~HoundDog
Just curious. For more information on this subject and several good viewpoints, check out this thread.
~HoundDog
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Feb 18, 2004 | 12:12 AM
#10
Pro Rider
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,387
Likes: 0
Howard Dean wants to ban atv riding?
dean sucks. Kerry is just as bad- go look at his website and download the 20 PAGE report that he wants to do with the environment. He hasnt made this public. He wants to undo everything the Bush admin did in regards to the enviroment. This is very BAD news. This means land closures and even to the point RESTRICTING YOU on your OWN land! dont belive me? read his 20 PAGE report detailing this.
He promises to enact it during his first 100 days in office. Oh yes its true, he is a radical and makes me sick! If he gets in, the second age of ATVS will be ending again. we cannot let him get in. Go out and vote like you have never voted before. Whether you like BUSH or not. you have to ask yourself," do I want to ride? Do I want to have places to ride?" If you answer YES to these then go VOTE FOR BUSH and DONT LET KERRY get in! RISE UP and lobby against him. When you RISE up- you stand up for your RIGHT TO RIDE!!!
He promises to enact it during his first 100 days in office. Oh yes its true, he is a radical and makes me sick! If he gets in, the second age of ATVS will be ending again. we cannot let him get in. Go out and vote like you have never voted before. Whether you like BUSH or not. you have to ask yourself," do I want to ride? Do I want to have places to ride?" If you answer YES to these then go VOTE FOR BUSH and DONT LET KERRY get in! RISE UP and lobby against him. When you RISE up- you stand up for your RIGHT TO RIDE!!!