This debate comes around once or twice a year. those of us that have been hanging around here for any time at all know what history has taught us, but for the novice out there.. here goes.

The consensus has been for a long time, that certain education is one way to improve things. The problem is, there is little consistency in the application from state to state. ASI has been trying to deal with this, but all you have to do is look at the numbers of new riders every year, and understand the very low percentage that actually avail themselves to the training to understand there are problems. Lack of qualified intructors is a real issue. The fact that the CPSC guidelines that go hand in hand with ASI are voluntary also contributes. ASI also will turn away prospective riders if they do not fit within the guidelines. IE a 11 year old child riding an 80 cc machine will not qualify until they turn 12. Even though the child has already outgrown the machine in size/fitment.

One of the real factors that contributes is the influx of cheap machines being sold on every street corner accross the country by manufacturers that couldn't care less if your kid has the proper training, or if the machine is right sized for the child etc. After all, they have your money right?

I personally believe that many parents DO care, but can't find enough real information to make good judgement calls. They turn to the bubba next door, and although they mean well, their advice may not be prudent.

Some manufacturers, Honda in particular, IS taking steps to help by building rider training centers, and making information availabe to dealers that can help parents find the data they need, however very few dealers even mention the existance of this data when making the sale, as it may turn the buyer away.

Also as a parent, you need to look beyond the physical characteristics of the child. Being physically capable of holding on, and hitting the throttle is only part of the equation. You need to consider the mental capacity of a child when confronted with potentially dangerous situations. Most young children can't even comprehend the dangers that the ATV represents. Put them into a situation, and you are inviting disaster.

Proper training is the key, and the younger they get it the better. that carries also a serious parental responsibilty that goes way beyond flashing the plastic. by law, in many states, a parent MUST be physically present at ALL times when kids are riding. Many don't even care.

Then there is the safety equipment issue. Certainly helmets, leather shoes over the ankle, eye protection, and long pants are a minimum. Neck rolls, gloves, chest protectors etc all add margin to the safety equation. More important though, is the examples we as adults present. You act like an idiot, and your child will imitate that. You sound off as if rules are for others, and they act in kind.

It comes down to a parent being a parent.. admitting that they do not have all the answers, and keeping an open mind to the reasons the "rules" exist in the first place. Common sense is the hardest thing to teach, and is usually learned from many painful experiences. The hope is, that with a little knowledge, you can cut those times of pain to a minimum.

Just out of curiosity, how many of us have taught our child how to make their way back to the tow vehicle in case the parent gets injured and needs emergency care? How may of us carry cell phones or other means of communicating when we ride in the woods etc. I have personally been there, done that. After a nasty crash that left me paralized from the neck down for a few minutes, and having to send a very scared child back to my truck to retrieve my cell phone to call for help, I learned a very good lesson that day. I have the 8 surgeries on my right knee and daily pain to show for it too. Yup, I am the poster boy....

 

CFC--
"2002 Fatality Risk Estimates Per 100,000 Participants
Motor Vehicles 14.9
Passenger Cars 7.1
ATVs 2.7

also fascinating your almost 3 times more likely to die in a car. hmm. "
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Methinks you might not be reading this data quite right. This data was compiled for trending, and I definitely wouldn't use it comparatively when debating with a tree hugger.

If "participants" spent the same amount of time riding ATV's as they do riding in passenger cars, you would be correct...or if they put the same number of miles on ATV's as they do on their cars.

Just to get this straight in my mind, I drive my truck about 15,000 miles a year, and my ATV about 1,500. As a participant in both ATV and passenger vehicle riding, I am 3 times more likely to be killed in my truck than on my ATV, disregarding miles or time spent participating in each transportation mode. But, considering that I put 10 times more miles on my truck...aw heck--someone else figure it out. I'm no mathematician.

 

If you put 3 times more miles you have to make the milage the same and you get something like 30 times more likely tio die ., if you put equal amount of miles on your ATV .

Please some one tell me I'm wrong or else I'm over due to be killed .

 

I disagree,

mileage has little to do with it

stupid=dead what ever you drive

What else should we factor in??? average miles per hour[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/img]

 

I have to agree with the stats, and general idea that our sport is really no more dangerous than others etc, but this is not the picture that those opposing us are making, and I dont remember the CPSC ever trying to outlaw volleyball for anyone under 16 or 18 etc.

I think we (and most others outside of offroading who were shown the real deal) would all agree that we are being unfairly discriminated against for many reasons (those with hidden enviro agendas, those repaying for campaign contributions etc), but it is still real, and something we need to prepare for.

 

Lets not forget the unfortunate individuals who were experienced, ready, and just by the luck of the draw etc ended up in trouble. Just like the really interesting new VW commercials where the camera shows vehicle occupants as an unexpected other vehicle slams into them t-bone etc you just cant prevent everything.

When I weed thru stats I always remember something my grandfather told me when I was younger "figures lie, and liars figure". To be honest that seems to come to mind when I question others interpetation of stats as well as when I am figuring my own interpetation [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

Point is that though as Americans we should exercise our right to question everything we deffinately should be questioning all of these various stats thrown at us, and be aware of where they are coming from. That way if or when we should need to debate them we will be ready.

 

[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif[/img] Bahh [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif[/img]
i drive my truck 40k a year and my ATVs 5k+ so 1/8 the miles i reckon.

So you sayin your a tree hugger? Most tree huggers i know wouldnt have the forsight to pull off an apples to apples comparrison like that..

 

We have all been bombarded with stories about how bad ATVs are for years. After a while you kind of start to be apprehensive. Remember this: The stories come from the popular media. The popular media is overwhelmingly controlled by liberals. The scientist who did that study was probably concerned about the accuracy of his report. Liberals are not concerned about accuracy. They will use their control of the media to present an inaccurate picture to support their agenda to have ATVs banned. They instinctively hate ATVs.

If you look at the chart you see that bicycle riding is twice as likely to land you in the emergency room as ATV riding. When was the last time you saw a media piece condemning the tree hugging sport of bicycle riding?

We are doing the responsible thing here by discussing and trying to figure out ways to make our sport safer. The same thing should happen constantly in all sports.

 

One of the more interesting things about the numbers is this. Considering that most of the injury stats are garnered from emergency rooms accros the country, and given the fact that doctors and staff are much more likely to report an ATV accident than they are a bike crash, I think what you are reading for bike injuries is only a small subset of what actually occurs. COnsider also that reporting usually centers around "SERIOUS" injuries. Small scrapes and bruises are ignored, so the stats are even higher. The problem with ATV accidents, is due to the weight of the machine and speed involved, a larger percentage of incidents actually require professional care.

What does all this mean? I think the buke numbers are much higher, and ATV riding is a much safer enterprise than what many may think. This should not preclude those of us with parental responsibilities from taking the maximum affordable steps to protect our own children. I don't know about you, but I'd rather be hugging my kids, then reading about them in a statistic somewhere. Especially when I could have prevented it. Things like riding double up, no helmets, kids riding machines way to powerful for them etc. These are under our control. I am responsible for attitude adjustment too. Making sure their heads are in the right place is a parent deal.

 

hey thanks guys for making my numbers wrong ,
so much has to to with your mind set and safty apperal,and even training .