A few here sound like politicians! Don't like it? Get involed and/or join an association that supports our cause!

"bring me solutions, not problems."

 

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: 400CatDriver
"...Well said sir! I've been of the opinion for quite some time that the American people have become sheep. We only have three real weapons to fight for our rights and what we want. Our voices (call or write that politician), our vote (if that politician doesn't respond), and our wallets....And stop buying that cheap Chinese crap at Wal Mart!..."

Well put and it really is as simple as that.
I guess that my problem with 'our voices' in relation to this sport; is that nobody is speaking for us presently that has an actual 'mandate' to do so. These leaders have purposely split the sport into just as many portions as these non-profit 'careers' could possibly support...and this pure selfishness combined many times with flat out greed has rendered us just about totally ineffective.

"...By the way...I agree with the other comments on responsibility. What ever happened to just being a good citizen? Pick up your trash and don't be a jerk out there!...."

Agreed again; yet I believe that properly led organizations with more of a 'zero tolerance' approach is our only means of getting unified voices together on even 'the basics' as you mentioned. If you've got guys out there more worried about closing down the trails to everybody but themselves and fighting the kind of privitized maintenance programs needed to actually get the job done when we're all dead and gone (not to mention 'closed door' policies regarding the discussion of funding matters that make the whole process work)...then you sure as heck aren't going to see them have 'time' for teaching the masses or even recruiting them if few desire to be associated with that kind of behavior in the first place.

Being rude and an arrogant self-centered greedy **** has its advantages...as if you're 'good' enough at it...everybody with half a dose of copmmon sense eventually leaves you alone to do whatever in the heck you may want with the resource.(which is why you don't witness the younger people we desperately need being taught to take over this mess and the same people time after time at these meetings..."if" some of these old coots choose to hold one out in the light of day).

 

Originally posted by: 400CatDriver
"...Well said sir! I've been of the opinion for quite some time that the American people have become sheep. We only have three real weapons to fight for our rights and what we want. Our voices (call or write that politician), our vote (if that politician doesn't respond), and our wallets....And stop buying that cheap Chinese crap at Wal Mart!..."

Well put and it really is as simple as that.

I guess my problwem with #1 in relation to this sport is that nobody is speaking for us that has an actual 'mandate' to do so. These leaders have purposely split the sport into just as many directions as a non-profit 'career' could be built on...and this pure selfishness combined many times with flat out greed has rendered us just about totally ineffective.

"...By the way...I agree with the other comments on responsibility. What ever happened to just being a good citizen? Pick up your trash and don't be a jerk out there!...."

Agreed again; yet I believe that properly led organizations with more of a 'zero tolerance' approach is our only means of getting unified voices together on even 'the basics' as you mentioned. If you've got guys out there more worried about closing down the trails to everybody but themselves and fighting the kind of privitized maintenance programs needed to actually get the job done when we're all dead and gone (not to mention 'closed door' policies regarding the discussion of funding matters that make the whole process work)...then you sure as heck aren't going to see them have 'time' for teaching the masses or even recruiting them if few desire to be associated with that kind of behavior in the first place.

Being rude and an arrogant, self-centered greedy **** certainly has its advantages...as if you're 'good' enough at it...everybody with even half a dose of common sense eventually leaves you alone to do whatever in the heck you may want with the resource!(which is why you don't witness the younger people we dso esperately need being taught to take over this mess and the same people time after time at these meetings..."if" some of these old coots choose to even hold one out here in the light of day).

This may not be what's happening in your neck of the woods, I oviously agree...yet it's funny to me that what happens at the largerst maintained system we have out there...should be such a 'non-issue' with both national leadership and the members that they serve...instead of a 'model' that neither one of these two groups choose to emulate or even 'debate' for reason of all the good people Michigan's goat rodeo has chased away.

 

Originally posted by: mywifesquad:
"I assumed your refering to the "current orv leadership" as the 2 wheeled guys". I have top wonder how many in Mich share your feelings.."

Current orv leadership (nationally) has supported whatever nonsense the "2 wheeled guys" in leadership locally have come up with for literally decades without question...always have...always will.
Think about it, MWQ...if you've got one segment of this community continually attempting to distance themselves both on the trail and even (unbelievably) "environmental impact -wise" from the rest of us...and these same people have 100% support at the top..what in the heck type of community can we build...with these very same people still in place?

As for anybody sharing my views(?)...I'd settle for a simple 'dispute' to anything that I've said here to date...which frankly just isn't going to happen(facts are facts).

"... BB we have been paying to play in Ca for over 30 years. There has always been more than enough money to take care of the off road needs and STILL there has been enough money for the California gov to steal from..They usually take more than 50% of what was taken in..."

If you guys have had more than enough money to meet all of your off-road needs over the last 30 years charging $13 per year at the most expensive place on the planet; while half of that paltry sum went down the toilet or was effectively used against you...well then, by gosh, that's one heck of an accomplishment.

Sorry, I'm not biting...[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

"...We pay $6.00 a day and $26.00 every 2 years for registration.."

What is $6 per day in California...in "real dollars" everywhere else?
A buck fifty?
$13 per year(?)....well, thank god that you don't have to pay $16.25 per year as we do here in Michigan...as that just about 'breaks' all of us guys out here riding nothing but bone stock $10,000 machines (we all just can't even afford the accessories, you know) picking pop bottles up by the side of the road for gas to get to the trailhead!

If your leadership isn't getting the job done and has gotten you into this massive closure mess by honestly not being very darn good at what they do...then for gosh sakes give everyone the boot that doesn't have the guts to admit that wwhat e've been doing for decades now...obviously isn't working.
Nobody wants to argue the fact that we're all divided and not anywhere NEAR being under the same roof them with the power needed to get the job done...but few in the sport are simply willing to admit that the emperor has no clothes.

(all for now; ran out of time...)

 

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: blackballed

(missed the above earlier....):

Heck, if it isn't DB out there trying to make friends with these doctors on a first-name basis; it's you.


From everybody out here who has enjoyed the time and effort that you've spent simply giving us your opinion; we all hope the surgery went well and godspeed with your recovery. (I'll try and give you some bathroom-grade reading material just as soon as possible).

Good luck!

John</end quote></div>

Its OK, its tough to catch everything in here. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

I definitely put this off too long. Not really fond of spending time in a Dr's office you know. It was my left hand that took too much abuse using the clutch all those years racing enduros.

I appreciate the kind words BB! [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img] The surgery went perfect as far as I can tell. The hand now feels like it has a slight sprain. The good news is my hand hasnt gone numb since the night before the surgery. I have been waking up with a numb aching hand for over 10 years. Its nice to sleep thru the nite for a change. I cant wait to see how it is to ride without slowing down to shake my left hand(to relieve the numbness while riding) every 5 minutes or so.

Thanks BB! Its going great so far.

Ill respond to the bathroom reading material in a few days when i get the time. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

 

That's good to hear and obviously something one can only pretty much appreciate after going through it for that length of time (Dragginbutt's story about made my body parts twinge also).

Modern medicine and the grace of God are both wonderful things and I'm looking forward to the both of them working on your recovery; along with hopefully a chance to someday receive your input on the issues which we face.

Best of luck,

John

 

(double post)

 

WoodRat,
I hope some took the time to review your post from August. Former USFS Chief Dale Bosworth took direction from the environmental community and decided that motorized recreation was one of 4 terrible threats to the public lands of the United States. He then quoted from their bias and directed the National Forests to eliminate motorized use. They have all focused on ATV restrictions as they thought it would be the easiest target. Go to the search engine on your computer and type in Bosworth American Hiker or Bosworth American cyclist and see what you get. This attack is nation wide, it is for the express purpose of eliminating public use of public land. This is a federal effort, not a private one. Check into it and you will probably fine that even the prospect trail system may be in jeopardy. Thank you for posting....Tass

 

stik it 2 the man!