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DS450x vs. KTM450xc

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  #11  
Old 11-19-2007 | 06:56 AM
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Default DS450x vs. KTM450xc

Go to WORCS and look at the results, they don't lie. Fredrick won the championship on the DS450, but it wasn't because of it. He race 10 times, 6 were on his Honda in which he got 5 wins and a 2nd. He raced the DS the last 4 races, got a 1st, a 15th, a 23rd and a DNF. Schell even did worse. And the break re-call for a bracket is all that KTM was for, but look at Farr race results. Way better then the DS.
 
  #12  
Old 11-19-2007 | 11:20 AM
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Default DS450x vs. KTM450xc

There must be something not great about efi in performance , the motocross 250/450 pro circuit still uses carbs, and they have the know how and money to mod to efi if they thought the gain was a advantage over the nexts guy,even though all motorcross bikes except Suzuki's 450 RM use carbs. In a recent 450 motocross shootout the Suzuki came in last efi and all .

The Manufacturers offer efi on there 450 ATVs but when it comes to the super competitive hold nothing back sport of motocross racing they are sticking to a carb for now.

Kawasaki's KX 450 was the fastest in the recent motocross comparison and uses a carb but on there sport 450 ATV with the same engine they use the throttle body efi,whys that?

Here is the link with the efi RM vs the rests with carbs. 450 shootout.
 
  #13  
Old 11-19-2007 | 12:55 PM
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Default DS450x vs. KTM450xc

Dude, the EFI is dominant in a lot more ways. Plus in that shootout there is nothing that says the EFI is slower. Speed and results of a shootout have a lot more than fuel delivery. There are a lot of other factors in these shootout results. first of all it's a suzuki no surprise on the result there, LOL. The EFI systems are put in there for way quicker throttle response, reliability, High performance at any altitude, No adjusting needed(Jets, Needles, etc.) Have you ever tuned a carb? It sucks! EFI is the way of the future and we will slowly see it catch on in the future. Ask anyone who owned a Raptor 660 and switched to a 700. Can Am is usually the front runners in high performance technology and you will see the results on the 2008 race circuits. They have had a lot of top racers sign on for the 2008 season, I think they will dominate a lot of the classes of quad racing but we'll just have to wait and see. I'm not really trying to argue here because I love both the KTM and the DS. I just like the DS a bit more because of a few items on it.
 
  #14  
Old 11-19-2007 | 01:14 PM
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Default DS450x vs. KTM450xc

ATVs use the "Throttle Body" Injection which is the most simple type of EFI and the closest to carburetion in operation. Fuel is injected above the throttle blades by one fuel injector nozzles. Both fuel and air are carried throughout the entire intake tract.

They do not use the much more sophisticated "Port Fuel Injection" or "Direct Fuel Injection" found in automobiles.

The 700 Raptor has a power advantage over the 660 do to it being a completely different engine not due to its EFI. Efi does not give a engine more horse power.
 
  #15  
Old 11-19-2007 | 01:21 PM
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Default DS450x vs. KTM450xc

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: TLC

ATVs use the "Throttle Body" Injection which is the most simple type of EFI and the closest to carburetion in operation. Fuel is injected above the throttle blades by one fuel injector nozzles. Both fuel and air are carried throughout the entire intake tract.



They do not use the much more sophisticated "Port Fuel Injection" or "Direct Fuel Injection" found in automobiles.



The 700 Raptor has a power advantage over the 660 do to it being a completely different engine not due to its EFI. Efi does not give a engine more horse power.</end quote></div>

Nobody ever said more horses, but when you put an efi controller it does give you a good jump on horses.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img] plus you don't need sophisticated efi for a single cylinder.
 
  #16  
Old 11-20-2007 | 04:55 PM
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Default DS450x vs. KTM450xc

a properly tuned carb will produce just as much power as EFI. Racers dont go through drastic elevation changes while on a course so there is really no advantage to using EFI on an MX track or GNCC style race. How is EFI more reliable than a good ol carb??? IF anything it is just the opposite when you start dealing with blown O2 sensors, electronics, etc. There is not much that can go wrong with a carb....

EFI controllers alone dont really make more power. They are used to adjust the fuel curves after performing mods (intake, exhaust, etc) Just like re-tuning a carb after doing the same mods...

For the average rec rider EFI makes sense but on the track it is still up for debate
 
  #17  
Old 11-20-2007 | 05:24 PM
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Default DS450x vs. KTM450xc

And why doesn't NASCAR run EFI. Everything on these cars is high tech but they are still running carbs......
 
  #18  
Old 11-24-2007 | 08:36 PM
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Default DS450x vs. KTM450xc

Ok guys here is the deal...both quads are great that is for sure, but the yfz beat the DS in a shootout. They complained about how the DS pushes in the turns & they always complain about low end power on ALL efi quads. Yes efi is also great but If you do motor mods it costs more to dial in. Now a no weld aluminum frame sounds nice but will it hold up to YEARS of abuse??? Let's get real KTM offers chromoly everywhere and we all know it is stronger. Suspension is always changed when it comes to racing so that is not an issue, but a hydrolic clutch is amazing, with easy access clutch cover...wow! Did anyone realize that the KTM also has reverse or how about a FACTORY teather or steering stablizer mounts or tappered berrings in the carrier with accessable grease zerks.The KTM is a better & STRONGER quad and the KTM engines are proven and have more hop up parts.
 
  #19  
Old 11-27-2007 | 01:34 PM
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Default DS450x vs. KTM450xc

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: DSengineer

And why doesn't NASCAR run EFI. Everything on these cars is high tech but they are still running carbs......</end quote></div>

Well, first of all, they're cars!! not ATVs, they'll be driving on a paved oval, not a muddy circuit, carbs just can achieve the maximum fuel flow necessary for speeds over 200mph, quads arent going 200mph, and with single cylinder engines, fuel injection is best, because it delivers precise fuel for the weather, air temp, and it can provide as much fuel flow as a carb can, but in better and more usable quantities. It'd be like saying saddles are on horses, so why not put saddles on cows and ride them
 
  #20  
Old 11-27-2007 | 04:04 PM
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Default DS450x vs. KTM450xc

To add to the Carb vs. EFI issue that some of you have. You can't just use racing as an example to use carbs. There are millions more consumers that buy these machines for recreational riding that would reap the benefits of EFI over Carbs. Look how many auto manufacturers use carbs these days, NONE. And high performance street bikes like the Hayabusa use EFI. So the all around benefits out weight the carb by a lot. You will see EFI more in the future race machines as well. It's just taking a while for everyone to catch on. We'll just have to wait and see. The future of sport quads is looking to be pretty awesome.
 


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