660s ride good for trails but not track. torque is actually slightly higher on the 660s way down low, but they require more body english due to their tippy nature. and even then its just too tippy and off center for me. i dont thnk you you like it the handling dept; needs to be much crisper for the track than a 660 can do.

forget about a 660 if you want to go to a track. you will get tired of fighting its inferior design. stick with the 700R for anything named a raptor.

 

I don't think the 700 would be better than the 450 for riding on a track. I personally haven't ridden a 700 but have friends that have and they said the 700 still felt tippy like the 660. Not as bad, but the 450 hugs the ground a lot better.

Recon99, I don't get where you are saying the 450 can't handle slow rides. Several people in our group have YFZ450's and they never have anyproblems on the slower trails.

 

no question 450 is better for the track - thats waht it was designed for; i think the consesus has been if primary riding is track, get a 450, if not get a 700. 700 was was thrown in b/c it does share parts with the YFZ and does have similar handling characteristics. before i get quoted, i said similar, NOT EXACT and wayy better than before and some other bikes. and i think earlier in the postings trail riding and stuff was mentioned as well...

ive never seen 450s have problems to the point of intolerable going slow either. now a banshee, on the other hand, it lives to rip all the time and isnt happy going slow that off topic but that the only quad ive ever had/ridden that hates to go slow.

raptor450- thats and interesting name.. i hope you DONT give yamaha any ideas! im getting tired of them calling everything a raptor and grizzly!

 

To me the 450's just don't feel at home on the trails at all. They don't have that low end grunt that most 4 strokes do, and they just completely beat you up on the rough trails. That little seat ain't too friendly especially when you're bouncing around on it so much because of the stiff shocks. Those stiff shocks make them awesome in the corners but over rocks they suck. I don't own one though, so I don't have as much seat time as some of you seem to have, that's just my opinion. They seem to get tempermental like 2 strokes when you ride the slow. I thought of getting one myself at one time, but just the thought of having no reverse really kept me away from them. Some of the tight spots you can get yourself into in the woods can be real tricky to get yourself out of if you're by yourself and you have no reverse.

I don't know where anybody could come up with 31hp as the output of a stock raptor 250, I think saying they have 17 horsepower is still being a little too generous. Come on, a stock 700 has something around 42 and it's 450cc's bigger! I don't have a lot of experience with the raptor 250's engine, but any other 250 4 stroke just isn't cost effective to mod at all. There are too many restrictions on them, and in the end you'll spend a fortune and still won't be satisfied with the performance. Plus once an engine is totally worked over it loses a good bit of it's reliability because everything is pushed to the limit. I think no matter what you do, you're going to get to a point with the raptor 250 eventually where you just can't squeeze any more out of it and you want to go faster. Then those thousands of dollars that you spent to make it go a little faster are gone forever instead of invested into a newer faster machine like you should have done to begin with. If you go straight to the top with something like the 700r or yfz450 you'll virtually never be able to run out of ways to make it faster or better, the aftermarket support is awesome.

So my vote is still going towards the 700. The kind of riding you want to do is pretty much what yamaha designed the 700 for. It can do good in any kind of condition, and will be able to handle whatever you dish out to it. It's your call though, you'll be making a small compromise whether you go with the 700 or the 450. With the 450 you'll have an extra edge at the track for sure, but the 700 gives you a better trail machine and a little less work to keep it maintained. I'm sure you'd be happy with your decision regardless of which one you decided on. Just don't put a lot of money into your 250, I can guarantee that in the end you'll regret it.

 

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: BamaSlamma

Wow! I didn't think that I would have gotten that many responses out of this thread; thanks guys!



Ok, so, first...bigned, I do love Honda cars and all, but I haven't heard too many awesome things about them as compared to Yamaha. And it's different on the other hand; I don't much care for anything else Yamaha, like drums or guitars or anything else like that. I mean, when I went to the dealership, I sat on a 300ex, or something to that effect, and I didn't care much for the height or the look of it. I have a Raptor now and I really love how they are. I think that I am going to stick there. But all the same, thanks man. I will keep that in mind.






I NEED A NEW TOY!</end quote></div>

i dont really like the 400ex myself it is to slow. i ride a raptor 700 and love it. its the best all around quad i have ever owned. even though mine does not have stock suspestion anymore the stock suspestion is very good exp on the newer or se models. it is very easy to get a ton of power out of these raptor with just a pipe intake and a powercommander. ive herd of people get 54hp at the wheels with barker duals , k&N intake and a pc3.

 

Recon99, the 700 SE sounds like the one for me....bit out of the price range brand new.

I know that the 700 is pretty heavy and I've heard that it is hard to muscle around the track and through trails, especially when you are going 40-45 m/h into a burn. Isn't that alot of weight to be pushing through a track at that speed?

I'm a small guy. Do you think that I could handle something like that, even with my daredevil side? Is it prudent?

 

The raptor doesn't feel like it's 400 lbs except when you're lifting it up. My warrior weighs about the same, and just due to the design it feels like it weighs twice as much. The Raptor feels very light, nimble, and easy to throw around considering that it's one of the largest engines available in a real sport quad.

You don't have to buy a brand new one. You really don't have to buy an SE either. All the 2008's have the good shocks, not just the SE's, and even if you did get a 2006 or 2007 without the good shocks on it, it's not hard at all to get a set of YFZ or the better raptor shocks (pretty much the same thing) on ebay and put them on later. I haven't looked at the prices on used YFZ shocks lately, but they used to sell for around 200-280 for a pair, which is dirt cheap considering how good these shocks are.

 

And really how much of a "small guy" are you? I know a little guy that races hare scrambles with a raptor 660. He's about 5"6 and he couldn't weigh more than 130 lbs soaking wet and he can still throw it around and make it do what he wants. And the 700's are still even more controllable than the 660's.

 

my buddy who wieghs no more than 130lb throws mine on the track with no problem. he can put a faster time with my raptor than with my other buddys 450. the times are not a consistant as the 450 though. i am in the 200lb range and it perfect size for me but i dont think you will have a problem with it.

 

BamaSlamma, you probably bought the wrong atv at first with the little raptor. Provided you have the means to upgrade so soon, I WOULD NOT get the 700 Raptor based on your stated usage. If you are going to be doing all track time with precious little trail riding, get a 450. Any 450 will do. The YFZ is a very well rounded package among its 450 peers and would be a great choice. You can find them used fairly cheap if you need to go that route although they are one of the least expensive even new. The bigger Rappy is just to tall and heavy for a machine that will live at the track. I have a YFZ, and have ridden several 700's. I feel that the 700 may also be a let down in the long run for your riding style. The most mx ready 450 is Suzukis' LT-R450. It is wider than all the others for better handling and can be uncorked the cheapest out of all the 450's. If I were buying a quad to only ride mx, the Zuk is my choice hands down.

What I encourage you to do is to research the bigger quads carefully, and be honest with yourself about what you need/want it to be capable of. You will find the overwhelming consensus is the 700 is better for trails while 450's are better mx machines(just like the manufacturers intended these respective models to be used.)

Good Luck with whatever you choose. There is no shame rocking the 250 for a year or two, but I would save any $$ for the next quad over performance upgrades.