Rocker cover
#1
Since I`m rebuilding the top end of my 185S. I`ve gotten up the following parts.
25 over 200X piston, a 200X jug, and a rebuilt cylinder head that came off the 185. I had new guides installed, new vesrah valves that I had back cut to help flow along with the valve springs checked and new valve seals, a high performance cam that`s slightly bigger than stock, a new 27mm carb that I`ll jet to size once I have it assembled. I was just reading on Ebay on the advertisement
on rebuilt cylinder head, and it says this: Because the cam journals wear evenly on the head and rocker arm cover we recommend that you not swap heads and rocker covers. Well, my 185`s pull start assembly no longer has the automatic compression release on it anymore, so I grabbed a used rocker cover from a older model that has the flip up type compression release. Am I going to run into a problem by using the older rocker cover? I see what they mean and it`s a good point, is there anyway I can reuse my rocker cover and install the manual compression release instead of trying to round up all the pieces to make the automatic release work? Since I`m using a X piston the compression will be in the 9:1 range and I don`t wanna break my arm off tryin to pull start it. Any help here is appreciated.
25 over 200X piston, a 200X jug, and a rebuilt cylinder head that came off the 185. I had new guides installed, new vesrah valves that I had back cut to help flow along with the valve springs checked and new valve seals, a high performance cam that`s slightly bigger than stock, a new 27mm carb that I`ll jet to size once I have it assembled. I was just reading on Ebay on the advertisement
on rebuilt cylinder head, and it says this: Because the cam journals wear evenly on the head and rocker arm cover we recommend that you not swap heads and rocker covers. Well, my 185`s pull start assembly no longer has the automatic compression release on it anymore, so I grabbed a used rocker cover from a older model that has the flip up type compression release. Am I going to run into a problem by using the older rocker cover? I see what they mean and it`s a good point, is there anyway I can reuse my rocker cover and install the manual compression release instead of trying to round up all the pieces to make the automatic release work? Since I`m using a X piston the compression will be in the 9:1 range and I don`t wanna break my arm off tryin to pull start it. Any help here is appreciated.
#2
First off, it is true that you must use the rocker cover that came from the head. If the camshaft journals arent enough of an issue to require it's importance,...a possible oil leak is. The head and rocker cover are cast as one piece from the manufacturer, and THEN it is split in half. They are perfectly matching parts so that the cam journal aligns as well as the mating surfaces. It's the main reason for them not using a gasket and using Hondabond to seal it instead.
Now,...I have in fact seen rocker covers swapped before and it not cause any problems, but it is still a risky idea.
As for changing the decomp shaft and arm to the manual type,...it's not a problem at all and wouldnt take but a min to swap. Just be sure to replace the oil seal because chances are that this will leak to due to possible uneven wear between the two shafts from two diferent rocker covers.
Finally, if you are installing a new cam, polish (not grind polish) the cam journal on both the rockercover and the head itself. You only have one upper and one lower journal to worry about since the other rides a stationary bushing. (more on that in just a sec) I have always used the Honda Metal Polish that you can get from Honda dealers that folks use to remove scratches from lexan windshields and to remove the "blue" from overheated exhaust pipes. The stuff does wonders for very small scuffs in the cam journals and doesnt effect your clearances enough to cause any problems.
Back to the bushing I wanted to mention,....
I have debated this with more than one in this forum over the years but I will continue to prach it,.... do NOT install that new cam without a new thrust washer AND bushing. They are still available from Honda and are worth every penny for insurance that you got your stuff right the first go around.
To the last question you asked, about pull starting the engine with those mods,.... it will definately be more resistance than what you are used to, but Ive cranked them with comp ratios over 13 and numerous mods and it wasnt a dramatic task. I guess it ultimately depends on your strength.
Your project sounds like it is taking form nicely well. Keep us posted on the progress.
Now,...I have in fact seen rocker covers swapped before and it not cause any problems, but it is still a risky idea.
As for changing the decomp shaft and arm to the manual type,...it's not a problem at all and wouldnt take but a min to swap. Just be sure to replace the oil seal because chances are that this will leak to due to possible uneven wear between the two shafts from two diferent rocker covers.
Finally, if you are installing a new cam, polish (not grind polish) the cam journal on both the rockercover and the head itself. You only have one upper and one lower journal to worry about since the other rides a stationary bushing. (more on that in just a sec) I have always used the Honda Metal Polish that you can get from Honda dealers that folks use to remove scratches from lexan windshields and to remove the "blue" from overheated exhaust pipes. The stuff does wonders for very small scuffs in the cam journals and doesnt effect your clearances enough to cause any problems.
Back to the bushing I wanted to mention,....
I have debated this with more than one in this forum over the years but I will continue to prach it,.... do NOT install that new cam without a new thrust washer AND bushing. They are still available from Honda and are worth every penny for insurance that you got your stuff right the first go around.
To the last question you asked, about pull starting the engine with those mods,.... it will definately be more resistance than what you are used to, but Ive cranked them with comp ratios over 13 and numerous mods and it wasnt a dramatic task. I guess it ultimately depends on your strength.
Your project sounds like it is taking form nicely well. Keep us posted on the progress.
#3
Thank you much knows. I will do as you ask and get the bushing and washer.
Even so I`m out of it right now with a back injury that`s fairly severe and they won`t let me work, I have to find things to do around the house. Since my 185 was worn out I thought I`d go with a overhaul since it`s so easy to remove the top end with engine still on. Come to find out, the intake valve was worn to a really thin edge, so compression was going right past it, no wonder I never could get it to idle. I have many other parts for it, I have a set of 200x hubs and wheels with new mud lite tires to go on them, someone had painted the whole thing camoflauge so I`m letting oven cleaner remove it for me, and I`m going back over it with black and red. Biggest problem I`ve ran into is my seat pan has rusted into nothing, and when one appears on ebay it goes for over $100 or more.
I also have a 200s in good shape that I got off ebay, it smokes like a fright train, and I`m redoing it as well, since I`m limited in what I can do, they are both slow process, but there coming.
Even so I`m out of it right now with a back injury that`s fairly severe and they won`t let me work, I have to find things to do around the house. Since my 185 was worn out I thought I`d go with a overhaul since it`s so easy to remove the top end with engine still on. Come to find out, the intake valve was worn to a really thin edge, so compression was going right past it, no wonder I never could get it to idle. I have many other parts for it, I have a set of 200x hubs and wheels with new mud lite tires to go on them, someone had painted the whole thing camoflauge so I`m letting oven cleaner remove it for me, and I`m going back over it with black and red. Biggest problem I`ve ran into is my seat pan has rusted into nothing, and when one appears on ebay it goes for over $100 or more.
I also have a 200s in good shape that I got off ebay, it smokes like a fright train, and I`m redoing it as well, since I`m limited in what I can do, they are both slow process, but there coming.
#4
One trick on those seat pans is to use an old rear fender to make one. Just cut out the portion that would normally be entirely covered from view by the seat. voila...instant plastic seat pan. Just drill holes for the brackets and thats it. When you bolt it to the rear fenders, the plastic will take ahold in perfect fashion, which it should considering that it was the same shape and contour because it WAS a fender. Something worth looking into. I have done it myself many times on many of the old trikes. In fact, the ATC70 in my pictures that I restored a couple years ago had a seat pan made from an old ATC70 rear fender.
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Sep 14, 2015 03:40 PM
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