<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Once you get in to a 450cc you are buying the engine from Suzuki (china plant) the cost of the engine is 3.5 times as much. + Water cooled. So the xtream ATV is nice but with a dealer price tag of 5000$ + dealers profit it will not be an easy sale. </end quote></div>Eugene,
I was referring to the TY 70, 90, 125cc Typhoon units which are much less than $5K. Roketa also introduced a similar unit, ATV-67, with photos on their site showing FYM decals. These are around $2K. BAMX also markets a similar unit. Until last fall Xtreme was able to keep the market to themselves but then FYM started getting distribution through others.


<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>in this case widen it make it sound cool sit low and wide and make it rip... make it so when all your buddies are laughting at it because it says jetmoto when you start it up and go they all close there mouths.. and do things that will promote it and make it so it will be talked about and not talked about how it is sitting in the garage. </end quote></div>Something similar to the Typhoon in a 350cc, under $3K would get folks excited, especially if it has looks and performance to keep up with out-of-box 400 size big brands. If it looks cool, sounds cool, and has great performance for cheap, that is a winning formula.

On to the topic of reliability and quality. One thing that is absolutely mandatory is the need for properly torqued and loctite bolts, nuts and screws. Even on the 150-200-250 models it is really unacceptable to deliver products where some many parts come loose, rattle, and fall off.

The local dealer network of the big brands does several things which are very important and has value. First, a professional completes assembly, inspects, and test the fully operational unit. Doing this reduces the vast majority of the initial quality problems experienced by the Chinese product. As you distribute all your product directly via the SF location, you can do some if not most of the checks performed by regular dealers. If you are willing to ship onward in modified crates, you might be able to do nearly all the same checks.

I know you need to ship as compact as possible in the containers but you could have the crating designed so that it could be easily modified to accept the fully assembled and tested atv. Another option is to pay up earlier in the process, probably cheaper, and have a real honest quality check done on the units before crating. I know it can be done as it is being done on the motors. There are very few problems with them so they have a proven process for sourcing good parts, assembly steps and quality checks. It just needs to extend to the units once assembled.

It is good to get input from a broad range of backgrounds. Many here are gear heads and can speak to and provide advice on the details of various components while others like myself have far less technical expertise but have the advantage of a new, recent, fresh, neophyte end user facing purchase of a sport ATV. I will say where the battery is located will not be on most buyer's checklist.

Top buying points:
* Performance, Features, Price, Quality
* Durability, reliability, and serviceability

 

Windtrader.

I know FYM and Typhoon products very well.
Let me show you some pics in the next few days. This will give you an idea what we have done.

Quality and performance , durability is the key of this unit.

I just want to add a few things that people like. To make our unit very attractive. We will do everything we can in our power to control quality. This is my #1 concern.

 

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>



On to the topic of reliability and quality. One thing that is absolutely mandatory is the need for properly torqued and loctite bolts, nuts and screws. Even on the 150-200-250 models it is really unacceptable to deliver products where some many parts come loose, rattle, and fall off.


</end quote></div>

I have to say the new Jet 150 I bought everything was tight on it. And it looked like someone checked things over at the factory as someone went over the bolts on the frame/suspension/engine with a blue marker.

But from past experience with Chinese quads I did the loctite on all bolts that went through plastic and support brackets for the plastic. So far no problems with things rattling loose.

My father bought a new Honda 250 utlity quad 2 years ago and I had to loctite some bolts on his fenders too as they rattled loose!!! But it looked like the rest of the frame/suspension bolts where checked and marked with a yellow paint marker. Now I don't know if that was done by the dealer or factory.

This 350 sounds REALLY interesting and it sounds like they got it covered. If Jetmoto builds it good it should be a real hit priced under $3K. A 2008 Yamaha Raptor 350 is $7299 dealer list price up here in Canada and wieghs in at 375lbs.


I like the idea of just using an air cooled 350 engine. Keep things simple and dependable. What make is this engine based on ?? Is a it "tuned up" clone of a past Yamaha engine?

It sounds like it could come with good air box/snorkel set up so if one goes through deeper water or some mud hole your still good to go!

 

Wow... sounds like a great ATV! I will definitely consider it when it's time to upgrade from my 90cc Baja.

 

some more ideas......

If you move the battery forward,it would leave room for a HUGE waterproof air box to house a large 2 stage foam air filter inside. (also suggested by Sawyer)

How about a O-Ring chain?

If you really want to get excited how about a 2 stage ignition? Flick a switch one way and get a torque power curve. Flick it the other way and get a high rpm power band, maybe even raise the rev limiter 1K RPM. (OK so Im dreaming)

Ive been looking at quad weights over the last week. 325 lbs is 50lbs lighter than a Warrior and 80lbs lighter than a 400EX. Its also about 25-40lbs lighter than the big 4's 450 Sport quads. Pretty impressive, specially when you consider those weights are "claimed" weights. Most likely all are a little higher than they claim. As long as strength isnt sacrificed in the frame/suspension this quad will be a real shocker.


Your 325 lbs goal....Is that for a quad ready to ride, except for gasoline?

 

Crap i was little disappointed today.



With gas, oil, nerf bars, heel guards and all nice stuff. 389 pounds.

This is not bad but i want less. I think will change the removable swing arm to Alloy, and few other parts to alloy.
We should reduce the weight by 10-20 pounds.

Will see.

PS 520 O ring chain is already on.

 

64 lbs is a lot to lose. But remember most of the Big 4 weights are with NO FLUIDS. No gas, no oil, no coolant, etc....

I wont post any of the pics you sent me Eugene. But I want to real bad!!!

Guys and gals let me tell you this quad is extremely trick looking.

Definitely 10 years or so ahead of the rest of the Jetmoto linup, and a few decades ahead of the rest of the quads from China.

 

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>PS 520 O ring chain is already on. </end quote></div>

I'm pretty sure the new 150cc has a 520 chain; if not, it is not a "standard" size. Here's a recent story that you might want to consider. I was at Carnegie a couple months ago and the 150 chain broke. I was not surprised as I heard many folks saying to replace the chain straight away. What surprised me is the chain size is fairly uncommon as the shop at the park had only one in that size while they have many other sizes. I was surprised since with all the hill climbs I figured they would carry the heavy duty chains.

Maybe you are thinking the 520 is a stronger chain and better but it seems the 350's power does not need such a big chain but it a standard sized good quality chain would be the better choice over the long haul.

FYI - I'm still under warranty on the 150 and 200 and the chain on the 200 also just got replaced. It always needed to be adjusted as it kept getting looser. Finally, there was no more adjustment and I could have taken a link out but when I took the chain to the shop, they showed how me how much play and slack was in the chain. It looked very worn out so I decided to put a new good chain on and so far it makes a noticeable improvement. Also, since I replaced the chain on the 150, I have not made a single adjustment to the chain.

So, in general, use better quality standard sized parts rather than oversized, not-standard sized parts.

One other related design principle which I think may help sell the new model(s) and strengthen and differentiate the brand is to strive to design in parts sized the same as common quality and performance after market parts. What this permits is the owner to actually have a stronger/better bike the longer it is owned as failing and worn out parts can be replaced with parts of better quality than the original.

The chain story I mention above is one example. I am also facing another similar situation with the front A arm bearings on the 200. From the start they squeaked and had play in them. They are under warranty but if they are the same poor quality parts than I don't even want free parts and would rather buy new high quality aftermarket bearings so I know that once the work is done, I won't have the same problem for a long time.

Just a couple more general comments from an enthusiastic customer.

 

1. FYI the chain on the 150cc ATV is a 530. Any cycle gear has these in stock.
2. Their is a common problem with Chinese made chains. First the quality of the steel is soft. Second the chain is so tight adjusted at the factory that dealers must loosen the chain slightly before selling the units. This will prevent is from straching as much.
O ring chain is a much better technology and built allot better. So we don't expect to see these problems in the future.
We have tested a nice TW made O ring chain and its working like clock work.
Bushings in the Aarms please check the size of the bolts in the aarms vs the size of the bearings inside. We don't use bushings on the aarms. They are actually bearings.
So please grease the bearings this will help with the squeaking noise.

 

Ive spent some more time looking over the pics Eugene sent me. Its going to be tough waiting until June to ride one of these. Right now there is only 1 of these quads in the world. With all the fiberglass on it (prototype parts that will be plastic in production), Eugene probably wont even let me sit on this one let alone ride it. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]