Honda 300 4x4 (General Part I)
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11-08-1999, 06:28 PM
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Gordon L Banks
The thread for the Honda 450 general comments seems to be working well, so I thought I'd start a similar thread for the venerable ol' Honda 300 4x4.
Mine is a red 1997 model. In January of 1997, I went shopping for a totally different machine, but one of the dealers I visited was overstocked on Honda 300 4x4's. With the hunting season drawing to a close, I guess he was inclined to deal. I really didn't want 300c machine, but I was aware of the Honda's reputation for quality, reliability, and minimal maintenance, and I'd already noted the unusually high prices being asked for used Honda 30's, so when the dealer made me an offer I couldn't refuse, I wasn't very upset about it. They are very popular in this area, especially with hunters.
The biggest thing I didn't like about the Honda 300 4x4 was that it comes with small 23" and 24" tires. But since I usually pull off and save the stock wheels and tires to reinstall later when I sell it, this did not represent an added expense or bother for the Honda, since I'd have done the same for whatever I bought.
So, first came ITP modular 12x7 wheels with zero-offset (so the tires would stay under the fenders as much as possible). Since this was early in my 4x4 experience, when we were eagerly riding all the mud holes we could find, I wanted the best mud tire I could get, but sized appropriately for a 300cc machine. According to the only magazine article I could find at the time, the Sand Tire Unlimited "Bi-Claws" and "Tri-Claws" were the best, so that's I bought for my 400cc Prairie. I wanted something smaller for the 300 so I bought 25x9 Bi-Claws for the front. Thinking that I needed 1" taller tire for the rear. Due to the comedy of tire size errors, this turned out to be then ear perfect setup! The 25x9 Bi-Claws measured only 24" tall (9.5" wide), while the 26x11 Bi-Claws measured 24.5" tall (10.25" wide). Despite the difference marking =, the two different sizes are very similar in size! These tires are not the answer for everyone, as their stiff sidewalls cause a harsh ride, and the wide-open tread pattern causes some wandering when ridden fast (35+) on smooth hard surfaces. I can't really comment on their "wear rate", as I've used no other tire on this machine, expect briefly, so I can't make comparisons. What I especially like about them is their effectiveness in mud, and their great resistance to punctures. I've accumulated numerous cuts, slits, and tears in the sidewalls of the six bi-claws and tri-claws I have, but have had only three flats among them, all form nails or something similar. They offer surprisingly good handling too. ON smooth loose surfaces, they slide before they cause lean and roll-over, and have proven very controllable and confidence inspiring. They work much the same way when I put them on my 450, but even better on the smaller and lighter 300.
I've installed Works Performance front shocks which are longer than stock, providing more ground clearance and more wheel travel, for slightly better comfort, and noticeably better handling at speed. What drives me crazy about the Work shocks, though, is that they 'top out' with a bothersome "clunk". Every time a front wheel comes off the ground, "Clunk!" goes the shock, as the wheel rebounds to full extension. If mounted upright, with the main shock body at the bottom, I'd guess that they had too little fluid in them. But these are Work shocks, with the main body on top, so it's not the fluid. I already sent them back once, but when returned they still have the same problem, as do the Work shocks on the rear of my 450. Again, they work fine, but the clunking sound and feel is most bothersome.
On the rear I'm using the stock shock, but on a homemade mounting plates that moved the lower mounting eye 1-18" forward and ¾" higher, providing more chassis ground clearance, more wheel travel, and softer spring and dampening (the dampening is actually to soft now, but livable). My 300 now has 10.5" of unladen ground clearance under the chassis, but only 7.5" under the rear brake drum.
I LOVE the Majer plastic skid plate for the Honda 300! I'd have one on all of my quads if they were available. It's under $60 with mounting hardware, light weight, durable, and slick! It's scratched and scraped and even slightly deformed, but it continues to work beautifully, and has never split, cracked, or broken. It's also available in several different colors. It has required no attention or servicing at all.
I ordered a set of Ox-Lite CV joint boot protectors, and a set of somebody's floor boards for it, but once I got a good look at them and saw how much they weighed, I returned them. Large CV joint protectors act like walls that you have to push forward through mud, and scoops that collect and hold mud on the a-arm. They are heavy, too. After I took a good long look at improving the lightweight plastic pieces supplied on the machine, I decided that they were good enough. I have had to replace one boot so far, but so have people with the larger and heavier protector plates, so I'm satisfied with the stock pieces.
I've rewired it to start in any gear (and still have the neutral light working normally), and I added a back-up light that came on only when reverse gear was engaged. Both re-wiring job were complicated, and required removing the front fender assembly. I would not bother with the back up light again, and would use a simple toggle switch instead.
I managed to get a Honda 300 speedo included when I bought mine, but I did not install it as per the kit instructions. In installed mine right over the handlebar clamps where it looks better, is better protected by the handlebars, and where it's easier to read, but right where it sometimes smacks me in the face when I lean far forward to get under a branch, just when the front wheels hit some kind of upward bump! Okay, so it ain't perfect, but I like it better than where Honda has you install it.
For more comfort I had the seat recovered, adding a ¾" firm foam pad o top, and another ¾" firm pad wrapped from side to side over the top, making it about 1.5" taller (until you sit on it), and 1.5" wider (more butt support area!). This has been one of my all-time better ideas! It really helps!
The 300 has some exposed rear axle on the left side, where one can fasten a rope to the wheel and let the spinning axle act like a winch. Other than a test to make sure it worked, I've never had to use it, but it's there!
The Honda 300 air and oil filters ate the same as those found on Honda 450's, so switching to an aftermarket air filter is, I believe, a waste of money for the 300. If that filter will flow enough air for the 433cc Honda 450, then it will certainly flow enough air for the 282cc Honda 300! I did remove the metal screen insert, however, which made a noticeable improvement at low RPM, but no real change at high RPM. Since this defies logic (a free flowing air filter would normally improve higher RPM more than low RPM performance), I believe the gain came providing a better fuel mixture. The same trick has worked on three other 300's, but made no improvement on two more. We use a short length of fuel line to block the mounting hole in the black rubber plate on the end of the air filter, letting the screw in the metal support bracket slide into the hole in the fuel line, which provides support at that end.
The biggest modification done to my 300 has been the Powroll Big Bore kit (313cc). Going from 282cc to 313cc is a 31cc gain, for an 11% increase in capacity. I also tried the Powroll pipe, and it provided a huge increase in mid-range power, but at the cost of way WAY too much noise, and too much torque loss at off-idle low RPM. With the Powroll pipe installed, the carb re-jetted, and the machine tied to a tree using a rope level with the ground, it would not spin the tires on dry grass in low gear at full-throttle! Switch back to the stock pipe and muffler, stock carb jetting and, perform the same test, I got four streams of dirt and grass flying through the air from four spinning tires, much like the stock machine does. The larger header pipe does wonders for mid-range and higher RPM, but it just killed the torque at low RPM, and especially right at off-idle. It felt much like a Yamaha 350 Big Bear of Wolverine, if you're familiar with them. It pulled hard, but not hard enough to spin the tires like it would wit the stock pipe. So, with the stock carb, stock jetting (it took me a full day of jetting experiments to discover that it ran the best with the stock jetting!), and stock pipe and muffler, the 313cc kit alone made a huge difference. Now I use 2nd in many places where I had used 1st gear when stock, 3rd gear instead of 2nd, etc. It will now accelerate side by side, up to about 35, with a stock Honda 450ES and 197 Kawasaki Prairie 400. (I think much of this is due to its lighter weight and lower gearing.) It's top speed remains about the same as stock, but it's torque and acceraltion have been greatly improved. There are two down-sides, however. One is that it now requires high octane gas due to the higher compression ratio. I use 91 or 93 octane to prevent pri-ignition (which I clearly have when using low octane gas). Second, it definitely runs hotter than it did when stock. This can be practically eliminated by raising the carb needle one notch, but at the expense of some power and throttle response, and using more gas. On a 90-degree or warmer day, I raise the needle one notch. On cooler days, I don't. I also change the oil now every 300 miles, probably just because it makes me feel better about it. And by the way, the above performance indicators are with the heavier and taller wheels and tires.
I have the Clymer manual for the 300 4x4. It contains many errors and odd omissions, but with careful reading and comparisons to the photo, it's useable. I'd much rather have the Honda manual, though, like that for the 450's it's excellent.
So far, the one CV joint boot has been the only 'failure' or problem with my 300. It has been totally reliable, trouble-free, and with minimal maintaence (just oil and filters). I change the spark plug and adjust the valves once a year. I inspect the air filter often, cleaning it when it needs it. I change the oil every 300 miles now, changing the oil filter every other oil change.
I use a large plastic storage box (a Polaris accessory) fastened to the rear rack with two bungee cords. Inside the stock storage compartments I carry only a spare right brake lever and a 50' length of tow rope.
The 'ball ends' have been cut off both brake levers, to lessen their chances of catching on vines, and to improve their chances of surviving roll-overs.
To reduce weight and mud build-up, I've removed the foot guards right behind the foot-pegs.
To reduce weight and mud build-up, I've removed the foot guards right behind the foot-pegs.
According the electrical wiring diagram for the Honda 300, it has a "warning box". I still don't know what it's for or what it does. The only 'warning' the Honda 300 has is an overheating indicator light which has never come on except during its cycle when you first switch the ignition on.
I'd like to install an oil cooler radiator and fan like that on the Honda 450, but they are so expensive!!
Maier also offers replacement plastic fender assemblies for the Honda 300 4x4, but I've never seen one. The rear one, I've read, does not include the stock storage box.
I guess that's all I have for now.
The thread for the Honda 450 general comments seems to be working well, so I thought I'd start a similar thread for the venerable ol' Honda 300 4x4.
Mine is a red 1997 model. In January of 1997, I went shopping for a totally different machine, but one of the dealers I visited was overstocked on Honda 300 4x4's. With the hunting season drawing to a close, I guess he was inclined to deal. I really didn't want 300c machine, but I was aware of the Honda's reputation for quality, reliability, and minimal maintenance, and I'd already noted the unusually high prices being asked for used Honda 30's, so when the dealer made me an offer I couldn't refuse, I wasn't very upset about it. They are very popular in this area, especially with hunters.
The biggest thing I didn't like about the Honda 300 4x4 was that it comes with small 23" and 24" tires. But since I usually pull off and save the stock wheels and tires to reinstall later when I sell it, this did not represent an added expense or bother for the Honda, since I'd have done the same for whatever I bought.
So, first came ITP modular 12x7 wheels with zero-offset (so the tires would stay under the fenders as much as possible). Since this was early in my 4x4 experience, when we were eagerly riding all the mud holes we could find, I wanted the best mud tire I could get, but sized appropriately for a 300cc machine. According to the only magazine article I could find at the time, the Sand Tire Unlimited "Bi-Claws" and "Tri-Claws" were the best, so that's I bought for my 400cc Prairie. I wanted something smaller for the 300 so I bought 25x9 Bi-Claws for the front. Thinking that I needed 1" taller tire for the rear. Due to the comedy of tire size errors, this turned out to be then ear perfect setup! The 25x9 Bi-Claws measured only 24" tall (9.5" wide), while the 26x11 Bi-Claws measured 24.5" tall (10.25" wide). Despite the difference marking =, the two different sizes are very similar in size! These tires are not the answer for everyone, as their stiff sidewalls cause a harsh ride, and the wide-open tread pattern causes some wandering when ridden fast (35+) on smooth hard surfaces. I can't really comment on their "wear rate", as I've used no other tire on this machine, expect briefly, so I can't make comparisons. What I especially like about them is their effectiveness in mud, and their great resistance to punctures. I've accumulated numerous cuts, slits, and tears in the sidewalls of the six bi-claws and tri-claws I have, but have had only three flats among them, all form nails or something similar. They offer surprisingly good handling too. ON smooth loose surfaces, they slide before they cause lean and roll-over, and have proven very controllable and confidence inspiring. They work much the same way when I put them on my 450, but even better on the smaller and lighter 300.
I've installed Works Performance front shocks which are longer than stock, providing more ground clearance and more wheel travel, for slightly better comfort, and noticeably better handling at speed. What drives me crazy about the Work shocks, though, is that they 'top out' with a bothersome "clunk". Every time a front wheel comes off the ground, "Clunk!" goes the shock, as the wheel rebounds to full extension. If mounted upright, with the main shock body at the bottom, I'd guess that they had too little fluid in them. But these are Work shocks, with the main body on top, so it's not the fluid. I already sent them back once, but when returned they still have the same problem, as do the Work shocks on the rear of my 450. Again, they work fine, but the clunking sound and feel is most bothersome.
On the rear I'm using the stock shock, but on a homemade mounting plates that moved the lower mounting eye 1-18" forward and ¾" higher, providing more chassis ground clearance, more wheel travel, and softer spring and dampening (the dampening is actually to soft now, but livable). My 300 now has 10.5" of unladen ground clearance under the chassis, but only 7.5" under the rear brake drum.
I LOVE the Majer plastic skid plate for the Honda 300! I'd have one on all of my quads if they were available. It's under $60 with mounting hardware, light weight, durable, and slick! It's scratched and scraped and even slightly deformed, but it continues to work beautifully, and has never split, cracked, or broken. It's also available in several different colors. It has required no attention or servicing at all.
I ordered a set of Ox-Lite CV joint boot protectors, and a set of somebody's floor boards for it, but once I got a good look at them and saw how much they weighed, I returned them. Large CV joint protectors act like walls that you have to push forward through mud, and scoops that collect and hold mud on the a-arm. They are heavy, too. After I took a good long look at improving the lightweight plastic pieces supplied on the machine, I decided that they were good enough. I have had to replace one boot so far, but so have people with the larger and heavier protector plates, so I'm satisfied with the stock pieces.
I've rewired it to start in any gear (and still have the neutral light working normally), and I added a back-up light that came on only when reverse gear was engaged. Both re-wiring job were complicated, and required removing the front fender assembly. I would not bother with the back up light again, and would use a simple toggle switch instead.
I managed to get a Honda 300 speedo included when I bought mine, but I did not install it as per the kit instructions. In installed mine right over the handlebar clamps where it looks better, is better protected by the handlebars, and where it's easier to read, but right where it sometimes smacks me in the face when I lean far forward to get under a branch, just when the front wheels hit some kind of upward bump! Okay, so it ain't perfect, but I like it better than where Honda has you install it.
For more comfort I had the seat recovered, adding a ¾" firm foam pad o top, and another ¾" firm pad wrapped from side to side over the top, making it about 1.5" taller (until you sit on it), and 1.5" wider (more butt support area!). This has been one of my all-time better ideas! It really helps!
The 300 has some exposed rear axle on the left side, where one can fasten a rope to the wheel and let the spinning axle act like a winch. Other than a test to make sure it worked, I've never had to use it, but it's there!
The Honda 300 air and oil filters ate the same as those found on Honda 450's, so switching to an aftermarket air filter is, I believe, a waste of money for the 300. If that filter will flow enough air for the 433cc Honda 450, then it will certainly flow enough air for the 282cc Honda 300! I did remove the metal screen insert, however, which made a noticeable improvement at low RPM, but no real change at high RPM. Since this defies logic (a free flowing air filter would normally improve higher RPM more than low RPM performance), I believe the gain came providing a better fuel mixture. The same trick has worked on three other 300's, but made no improvement on two more. We use a short length of fuel line to block the mounting hole in the black rubber plate on the end of the air filter, letting the screw in the metal support bracket slide into the hole in the fuel line, which provides support at that end.
The biggest modification done to my 300 has been the Powroll Big Bore kit (313cc). Going from 282cc to 313cc is a 31cc gain, for an 11% increase in capacity. I also tried the Powroll pipe, and it provided a huge increase in mid-range power, but at the cost of way WAY too much noise, and too much torque loss at off-idle low RPM. With the Powroll pipe installed, the carb re-jetted, and the machine tied to a tree using a rope level with the ground, it would not spin the tires on dry grass in low gear at full-throttle! Switch back to the stock pipe and muffler, stock carb jetting and, perform the same test, I got four streams of dirt and grass flying through the air from four spinning tires, much like the stock machine does. The larger header pipe does wonders for mid-range and higher RPM, but it just killed the torque at low RPM, and especially right at off-idle. It felt much like a Yamaha 350 Big Bear of Wolverine, if you're familiar with them. It pulled hard, but not hard enough to spin the tires like it would wit the stock pipe. So, with the stock carb, stock jetting (it took me a full day of jetting experiments to discover that it ran the best with the stock jetting!), and stock pipe and muffler, the 313cc kit alone made a huge difference. Now I use 2nd in many places where I had used 1st gear when stock, 3rd gear instead of 2nd, etc. It will now accelerate side by side, up to about 35, with a stock Honda 450ES and 197 Kawasaki Prairie 400. (I think much of this is due to its lighter weight and lower gearing.) It's top speed remains about the same as stock, but it's torque and acceraltion have been greatly improved. There are two down-sides, however. One is that it now requires high octane gas due to the higher compression ratio. I use 91 or 93 octane to prevent pri-ignition (which I clearly have when using low octane gas). Second, it definitely runs hotter than it did when stock. This can be practically eliminated by raising the carb needle one notch, but at the expense of some power and throttle response, and using more gas. On a 90-degree or warmer day, I raise the needle one notch. On cooler days, I don't. I also change the oil now every 300 miles, probably just because it makes me feel better about it. And by the way, the above performance indicators are with the heavier and taller wheels and tires.
I have the Clymer manual for the 300 4x4. It contains many errors and odd omissions, but with careful reading and comparisons to the photo, it's useable. I'd much rather have the Honda manual, though, like that for the 450's it's excellent.
So far, the one CV joint boot has been the only 'failure' or problem with my 300. It has been totally reliable, trouble-free, and with minimal maintaence (just oil and filters). I change the spark plug and adjust the valves once a year. I inspect the air filter often, cleaning it when it needs it. I change the oil every 300 miles now, changing the oil filter every other oil change.
I use a large plastic storage box (a Polaris accessory) fastened to the rear rack with two bungee cords. Inside the stock storage compartments I carry only a spare right brake lever and a 50' length of tow rope.
The 'ball ends' have been cut off both brake levers, to lessen their chances of catching on vines, and to improve their chances of surviving roll-overs.
To reduce weight and mud build-up, I've removed the foot guards right behind the foot-pegs.
To reduce weight and mud build-up, I've removed the foot guards right behind the foot-pegs.
According the electrical wiring diagram for the Honda 300, it has a "warning box". I still don't know what it's for or what it does. The only 'warning' the Honda 300 has is an overheating indicator light which has never come on except during its cycle when you first switch the ignition on.
I'd like to install an oil cooler radiator and fan like that on the Honda 450, but they are so expensive!!
Maier also offers replacement plastic fender assemblies for the Honda 300 4x4, but I've never seen one. The rear one, I've read, does not include the stock storage box.
I guess that's all I have for now.
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11-08-1999, 06:29 PM
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Gabby
I have owned 4 - 300 4x4 Hondas and think they are the best bike ever made in their category. I sold my last one to pay taxes and now I have saved enough to buy another bike. I haven't been able to find any comments about the 400 foreman 400 4x4 but I am still looking. Enjoy your 300 for I am sure it won't let you down.
I have owned 4 - 300 4x4 Hondas and think they are the best bike ever made in their category. I sold my last one to pay taxes and now I have saved enough to buy another bike. I haven't been able to find any comments about the 400 foreman 400 4x4 but I am still looking. Enjoy your 300 for I am sure it won't let you down.
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11-08-1999, 06:30 PM
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Mattsibley
Gordon,
What is the best thing I can do to regain my lost power from putting on vampires? I wish I could spin them faster. I don't want to really modify the main engine. (pistons, cams) I think that it may cause more damage than good. So what is a good mod to regain that little bit of low-end power I lost with the bigger tires?
Gordon,
What is the best thing I can do to regain my lost power from putting on vampires? I wish I could spin them faster. I don't want to really modify the main engine. (pistons, cams) I think that it may cause more damage than good. So what is a good mod to regain that little bit of low-end power I lost with the bigger tires?
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11-08-1999, 06:30 PM
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Mattsibley
I have a 199 Honda 300 4x4. Its performance is superb. I just put 24x9x11 and 25x12x11 vampires on it. It's a great mud dog. I also plan to get a locker a lift kit and some floorboards in the future. I have had no problem out of my 300 except one flat stock tire. It's a great and powerful machine for its class. GO HONDA!
I have a 199 Honda 300 4x4. Its performance is superb. I just put 24x9x11 and 25x12x11 vampires on it. It's a great mud dog. I also plan to get a locker a lift kit and some floorboards in the future. I have had no problem out of my 300 except one flat stock tire. It's a great and powerful machine for its class. GO HONDA!
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11-08-1999, 06:31 PM
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11-08-1999, 06:32 PM
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Gordon L Banks
Matt, without making some engine mods, I'm not sure you can replace the power absorbed by the Vampires. I'm afraid you've simply installed too much tire for a 300 size 4x4. Super Swampers up to 11" wide generally work fine, but Super Swampers Vampires, I'm afraid, especially in the larger rear tires sizes, are just too big and heavy.
There are several products available that will enhance your mid-range power, such as the highlifter product "performance kit". Despite what some may say, I don't believe a different air filter will help out at all. Honda uses the same air filter on the 300 and 450, so if it will flow well enough for a 432cc, it will flow enough for a 282cc. When we installed the highlifter high performance kit on Steve West's Honda 300, we tried comparing the K&N filter with the stock filter (w/o the metal screen), and saw no difference at all. This is assuming that you have already removed the stock metal screen from inside your filter, and filed the hole at the support bracket end. The kit also includes a carb jetting kit, a new cam, and a new pipe and muffler, all of which combined to make a significant boost in mid-range, but not in off-idle or low RPM power.
I've heard that the cam from the 1989 model will enhance the low-end torque of newer models, but I don't know anyone who has actually done this. The best and surest way to increase low RPM torque is to increase the engine size and/or boost the compression, al of which requires modifying the engine.
If there were an easy way to improve an engine's power without modifying it, it would be so widespread popular, everyone would already know all about it.
Beware of aftermarket pipes with bold claims of increase power. I've not seen one yet that increased off-idle and low RPM power the stock pipe. You can find a lot more mid-range power with the better pipes, but at the expensive of more noise and/ or less off idle-power. And once you're stuck, if you don't have good off-idle power, your really stuck!
Matt, without making some engine mods, I'm not sure you can replace the power absorbed by the Vampires. I'm afraid you've simply installed too much tire for a 300 size 4x4. Super Swampers up to 11" wide generally work fine, but Super Swampers Vampires, I'm afraid, especially in the larger rear tires sizes, are just too big and heavy.
There are several products available that will enhance your mid-range power, such as the highlifter product "performance kit". Despite what some may say, I don't believe a different air filter will help out at all. Honda uses the same air filter on the 300 and 450, so if it will flow well enough for a 432cc, it will flow enough for a 282cc. When we installed the highlifter high performance kit on Steve West's Honda 300, we tried comparing the K&N filter with the stock filter (w/o the metal screen), and saw no difference at all. This is assuming that you have already removed the stock metal screen from inside your filter, and filed the hole at the support bracket end. The kit also includes a carb jetting kit, a new cam, and a new pipe and muffler, all of which combined to make a significant boost in mid-range, but not in off-idle or low RPM power.
I've heard that the cam from the 1989 model will enhance the low-end torque of newer models, but I don't know anyone who has actually done this. The best and surest way to increase low RPM torque is to increase the engine size and/or boost the compression, al of which requires modifying the engine.
If there were an easy way to improve an engine's power without modifying it, it would be so widespread popular, everyone would already know all about it.
Beware of aftermarket pipes with bold claims of increase power. I've not seen one yet that increased off-idle and low RPM power the stock pipe. You can find a lot more mid-range power with the better pipes, but at the expensive of more noise and/ or less off idle-power. And once you're stuck, if you don't have good off-idle power, your really stuck!
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11-08-1999, 06:32 PM
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Mattsilbley
Well highlifter says that their high performance kit will regain almost all of my lost power. I'm not sure though. I also seem to be confused. Is low-end power used mostly in mud holes or is mid-high range? I want to have enough power to turn my tires in 2nd gear like I can in first at the present time. Highlifter has a pretty high price for their kit and if it really doesn't help then I don't want to waste my money.
Well highlifter says that their high performance kit will regain almost all of my lost power. I'm not sure though. I also seem to be confused. Is low-end power used mostly in mud holes or is mid-high range? I want to have enough power to turn my tires in 2nd gear like I can in first at the present time. Highlifter has a pretty high price for their kit and if it really doesn't help then I don't want to waste my money.
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#8
11-08-1999, 06:33 PM
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Mattsibley
Gordon,
I get what you saying. Did highlifter high performance kit lose any of the idle power? It is low enough right now and if I lose anymore it would really suck. What kind of engine mods could possibly work to get more low-end power? I'm not to familiar with this stuff so say it in as understandably terms as possible. Thanks again.
Gordon,
I get what you saying. Did highlifter high performance kit lose any of the idle power? It is low enough right now and if I lose anymore it would really suck. What kind of engine mods could possibly work to get more low-end power? I'm not to familiar with this stuff so say it in as understandably terms as possible. Thanks again.
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11-08-1999, 06:33 PM
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Gordon L Banks
Matt, I've helped install and test the highlifter high performance kit for the Honda 300 4x4 on only one machine, that belongs to Steve West (wests@hiwaay.net). I think Steve and I agree that the kit made a worthwhile difference in the mid-range, but little or no difference at odd-idle or very low RPM.
What RPM range you use in the mud depends on the RPM you're using as you enter the mud, and whether or not you come to a stop. If you keep moving, then you'll be able to use higher RPM, and have more power. But if you come to a stop, regardless of where you are, you have to use off-idle and low RPM power to get moving again. If you have too little low RPM power to get moving, then you are really stuck.
With the stock pipe and muffler installed, I can tie my 300 to a tree in my yard (keeping the rope parallel to the ground), put it in 1st gear, and apply throttle. It will start digging four holes as all four wheels begin to spin and dig into the yard. Then install the Powroll pipe, with a larger header pipe, and try the same test. The larger pipe causes such a loss in off-idle power (i.e., very low RPM), it would no longer spin the tires… it just sat and strained against the rope. Allowed to accelerate freely (i.e., not tied to a tree), the pipe provided a very nice boost in mid-range power, but that wouldn't help any once I was stopped in a bad mud-hole or a very steep hill.
If you want your Honda 300 4x4 to have as much low end in 2nd gear as a stock one has in 1st gear, then I suggest you look into replacing the engine with something around 450-500cc, or adding some form of supercharging! The gearing is s o much lower in 1st and in 2nd, and the resulting torque to the wheels so much higher, I fear your quest is unreachable, especially since you don't want to modify the engine. Your basically asking for a way to have the torque of a 400-500cc machine, but without modifying the engine. It just isn't going to happen.
I have a 1989 Ford Mustang with a 306 cubic inch engine that produces more torque and more HP than average 400 to 460 cubic inch streetcar engines. How did I do that? With about $5000 worth of carefully chosen parts and modifications, not just a few new carburetor jets, a new air filter, and a new exhaust pipe. The only way to beat cubic inches is with cubic money.
Matt, I've helped install and test the highlifter high performance kit for the Honda 300 4x4 on only one machine, that belongs to Steve West (wests@hiwaay.net). I think Steve and I agree that the kit made a worthwhile difference in the mid-range, but little or no difference at odd-idle or very low RPM.
What RPM range you use in the mud depends on the RPM you're using as you enter the mud, and whether or not you come to a stop. If you keep moving, then you'll be able to use higher RPM, and have more power. But if you come to a stop, regardless of where you are, you have to use off-idle and low RPM power to get moving again. If you have too little low RPM power to get moving, then you are really stuck.
With the stock pipe and muffler installed, I can tie my 300 to a tree in my yard (keeping the rope parallel to the ground), put it in 1st gear, and apply throttle. It will start digging four holes as all four wheels begin to spin and dig into the yard. Then install the Powroll pipe, with a larger header pipe, and try the same test. The larger pipe causes such a loss in off-idle power (i.e., very low RPM), it would no longer spin the tires… it just sat and strained against the rope. Allowed to accelerate freely (i.e., not tied to a tree), the pipe provided a very nice boost in mid-range power, but that wouldn't help any once I was stopped in a bad mud-hole or a very steep hill.
If you want your Honda 300 4x4 to have as much low end in 2nd gear as a stock one has in 1st gear, then I suggest you look into replacing the engine with something around 450-500cc, or adding some form of supercharging! The gearing is s o much lower in 1st and in 2nd, and the resulting torque to the wheels so much higher, I fear your quest is unreachable, especially since you don't want to modify the engine. Your basically asking for a way to have the torque of a 400-500cc machine, but without modifying the engine. It just isn't going to happen.
I have a 1989 Ford Mustang with a 306 cubic inch engine that produces more torque and more HP than average 400 to 460 cubic inch streetcar engines. How did I do that? With about $5000 worth of carefully chosen parts and modifications, not just a few new carburetor jets, a new air filter, and a new exhaust pipe. The only way to beat cubic inches is with cubic money.
#10
11-08-1999, 06:34 PM
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Gordon L Banks
"Did highlifter high performance kit lose any of the idle power?"
We think not. Steve's Honda 300 passed the "tree test" before and after installing the kit, and the results were basically identical.
"What kind of engine mods could possibly work to get more low end power? I'm not to familiar with this stuff so say it in as understandably terms as possible."
Basically, more cubic inches and/or more compression.
1. Low cost - low gain: You can replace the cylinder base gasket with a zero-thickness sealant to raise the compression, but the gain is small for the amount of work required.
2. Moderate Cost - Low Gain: You can replace the piston with a high-compression piston to get even more compression, but here again, the again is small for the cost and amount of work required.
3. High Cost - High Gain: You an install a Big Bore Kit to enlarge the engine and raise the compression at the same time. Because of their outstanding reputation for quality and service (they've been in business for over 30 years), I chose the Powroll 313cc kit, but others are available. Total cost for the kit and the required machine shop work will be close to $400, and you still have to provide the labor for top-end (head, cylinder, and piston) disassembly and reassemble, but the results speak for themselves. With the stock carb and stock exhaust pipe, my 300 (now 313) feels like a typical 400cc machine. It will accelerate side by side with a stock Honda 450, up to about 35 mph.
"Did highlifter high performance kit lose any of the idle power?"
We think not. Steve's Honda 300 passed the "tree test" before and after installing the kit, and the results were basically identical.
"What kind of engine mods could possibly work to get more low end power? I'm not to familiar with this stuff so say it in as understandably terms as possible."
Basically, more cubic inches and/or more compression.
1. Low cost - low gain: You can replace the cylinder base gasket with a zero-thickness sealant to raise the compression, but the gain is small for the amount of work required.
2. Moderate Cost - Low Gain: You can replace the piston with a high-compression piston to get even more compression, but here again, the again is small for the cost and amount of work required.
3. High Cost - High Gain: You an install a Big Bore Kit to enlarge the engine and raise the compression at the same time. Because of their outstanding reputation for quality and service (they've been in business for over 30 years), I chose the Powroll 313cc kit, but others are available. Total cost for the kit and the required machine shop work will be close to $400, and you still have to provide the labor for top-end (head, cylinder, and piston) disassembly and reassemble, but the results speak for themselves. With the stock carb and stock exhaust pipe, my 300 (now 313) feels like a typical 400cc machine. It will accelerate side by side with a stock Honda 450, up to about 35 mph.