I watch the GNCC on the OLN and wonder what would happen if more top riders went to the pro production (pp). So far 2 race overalls have been won from that class w/ another almost but the rider had a flat. All three times were the same rider a former pro rider trying to get more attention to the class.
That leaves me to beleive the 250R base quads have meet their match now. There is only 1 really top rider in the pp class and he is always up front. So I am left worndering if the 4 stroke quads w/ more top riders on them would not finaly make the R obsoleate. I know this is a hot topic but if you realy stop and think of who is riding what you see the top riders are in the pro class not the pp save one and he is kicking serious A@@ in fact he is having a better season this year than last, thats right he is faster on a production based quad.

 

You will find that the numbers in the 250A &B classes are also down from the years before. I have also heard that some of the top pro's will be on OEM quads next year. I hate to say it but the writing is on the wall for the 250R, just it was for the ATC250R.

 

At that level, the quads are pretty far from stock, even the production class. So, the writing is on the wall, so to speak, as more great riders start riding the newer machines. These guys will do well on any race prepped machine, no matter what flavor it is. So is the 250R obsolete? Hardly.

 

The R will never become obsolete, think about it. Look at all the manufacturers who have copied it's frame geometry, Cannondale being one example. It may not say Honda on it but because the design was so perfect to begin with, it will never be obsolete. As they say, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery!!

Now will the 2 stroke eventually go away, yea in a few years but only because it will be mandated out of the racing scene due to emissions and the EPA. Certainly not because it cannot generate the power to compete with the thumpers. Hell, look now, it takes a 450 4 stroke to barely beat a 265 2 stroke. Allow rule changes to kick up the 2 stroke cc to a 295 or 310 and then let's see the results.

 

I under stand your arguments but I think in woods racing a lot more power would not do a bunch of good. You need to get it down. In the past I raced a quad racer tecate 4 and 250R in the woods, all were miled power plants we wanted trackability and reliability. We used big fly wheel weights and higher gearing to hook up. I see the 4 stroke quads putting 1 darn near all of its power to the ground better. I know the pro production quads are not stock I think the 400ex that one was a 500cc quad but my wole point was that a top rider went to this class and is now running w/ the 250R bikes. I am curious if more of the top riders went would they be up front as well. I am not sure I am explaning my point all togther I am not putting down any quad it just seams to me in the slick and tech races the PP class quads are working a little better and seing a rider who ran up front in the past switch and in his first year of sorting out a new bike is actually doing better than ever. Did he get better or is the quad helping out.

 

Daimon,
Without looking, I believe the only Pro-Pro rider to win an overall was Chad Duvall at Sparta. I think this was a mudfest where traction was at a premium. Most of the races I have followed have been 250r blowouts. Are it's days numbered? yeah probably. Will it be because of "outdated" design or promoter's rule changes, that's the question. I always bring up the example of Harley's dominance of Dirt Track, obviously it's not the fastest engine available, but it works best under the current rules for it's intended application.

 

The only time Harley dominates the dirt track is when Nicky Hayden is too busy to drop by and whoop things up on his CRF450R... [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

 

Alaska, don't even joke around. Nicky finished 13th when he stepped up to the 750's [Honda's RS is no match for the XR's]. Could'nt let that one get by even thou I saw the wink.

 

I do not remember I think you are correct about Chad but he has 2 overalls now and the race I watched Sunday he was way out front when he had a flat. Again only one rider capable of taking the overall is in the Pro-pro what if there were more?

 

We have been racing 250Rs for years but are gradually headed to the fourstrokes ourselves. I have one son who has been changing to a 400EX in the past few months and my other boy is just waiting for Honda or Yamaha to bring something next year or he will buy a Cannondale. I already told him he would be disowned if he did that simply because he doesn't know what he's getting into. I have seen them race around here and they are a perfect example of copying and absurd prices.

If he waits till next year, I will build him a CRF450 quad rather than buying him a Cannondale.

I am looking at a Z400 myself because no one down here are riding them on the MX tracks. I'm not as fast as I used to be anyway, but am still capable of smoking any R regardless of it's setup.

As much as I hate to say it, I agree with the majority here that the 250R is on it's last leg. Getting way too expensive to. Have any of you noticed that the major companies don't seem to keep as much 250R parts anymore?? Everything kept in stock nowadays seem to be for 400EX or Z400 models.

I guess by this time next year, I will know if we did the right thing by switching to fourstrokes. Until then, we will continue with our race success the best we can with waht we have avaiable.

Captain