if you moved it one tooth on the cam sprocket it's 20 deg retarded not 10deg

stock 650-700 is run 10deg advanced from stright up more bottom end
on tooth would be 10deg retarded from stright up you will lose bottom end

 

However many degrees it is, it works. If I can do that well against a stock V, it did the job. I have WAY more throttle response that I did before, and I haven't even done the timing key, yet.

 

REDS650... what IS really involved in retarding the cams only 10*, & what, would / could, be the problems with moving them 1 tooth ( 20* ).,. for informational purposes ( my FST cams don't need to be retarded )...

 

CustomFab,
What is your new top speed with the cams retarded 20* ???

Newbeatle,
For what its worth, here's my guess at the impact of retarding the cam position by 20* The stock P650/P700 cam position (which is advanced 10* as compared to V-force cams) shifts the powerband to the low rpms (which makes sense for a utility quad that is designed to pull heavy loads, etc.); whereas the stock V-force cam position provides more power in the mid to top end (which makes sense b/c this is designed as a high speed sport quad).

IMO, its a zero sum game here and by moving the cam position, you are simply making the most of a different part of the powerband. My best guess is that Customfab's results of retarding the cam position by 20* is that he will have a little less low end power and a lot more top speed (assuming he didn't retard the cam position too far). Its just a guess tho and I could be way off here!

Happy trails...[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

 

REDS650,
I have another question about the cams. Do we know that 10* provides the most power of any setting. I know this is what the V runs, and its supposed to be strait up, but is it possible that 12*, 15*, or maybe even 20* could provide more power. I guess I'm thinking if he can hang with a V, dang that is impressive. Also, could the extra retard be effective because the ignition timing is also retarded from the factory? I'm probably just blowing smoke here, but this is getting interesting and I'd love to here some input from the masters on this one.

 

IT's possible more is better you will lose alot of bottom end if you go to far
The stock ignition timing may kill some of your top end gain
With the cams stright up it makes power 6500-7000 well into the timing retard
pulls to 8000-8200 with my higher gearing that's with a box on the back also was on a lake so it,s not down hill top speed was 112-115kph [70-72mph] may of went faster without the cargo box [2-3kph] rev limit is 119kph

 

Maybe someone with a V should retard their cams another 5-10 degrees and see what happens. I think that going beyond 10 degrees from stock is a little much for a 600 pound 4x4, unless you consistently drive at 40+ mph and have the clutching to keep the rpm's up. It might be more suited to the V-Force.

 

Guys at the risk of sounding dumber than mud here. I have been reading a lot of these posts since I bought my 700 Prairie I assume that everything you are recomending for the 650 except the belt change will apply to the 700 too. I hope so because I have started trying to put some money towards building mine up, and it is really going to torque me if a 650 that doesn't have major mods can beat me when I'm done. I ordered a filter and was going to pick up the NAPA hose this weekend. I am trying to get with a friend who is a good welder to do the Nyroc mod to the muffler. And I am waitting to see the actual price on the CDI sounds like I will need a cam too. You guys keep getting me in trouble with the boss over things I think I need after reading these posts. I should have her yell at all of you since your posts were the reason I went and rode a prairie in the first place when I was looking for another quad. Powers is addictive you know we might have to start having power addiction meetings!

 

DIRTVH... so far, everything but some belt mods are all capable of doing on the 700... & you already have the good belt... there have been no differences made to parts needing modifdication, since the '03 Prairies...

 

My top speed went to 69 MPH. I can't wheelie in high without pulling on the bars, but once it gets into midrange the power is awesome! I'm guessing that when I do my timing key, I'll be able to stay right with the V, maybe even pull ahead. I now realize that I took the timing farther than I had intended, but it's working fine, and I won't change it back, until I get the Webb cams.