Howdy Wires,
I think that you are espousing erroneous information about the modules. In fact I am sure that you are full of effluvium. I have run two equal Prairies ,both with Holeshots. We removed the Holeshot from one and added the DG3. There was a large difference in a 300 foot run. The Holeshot wasnt even close. You can put forward your theories about how they work. I have seen the difference in performance in 2 different modules. Now you can talk all the b.s. that you wish about all modules being the same in performance. You are wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Test equipment doesn't lie, and the test results posted in this thread don't show any HUGE performance differences. 0.2 seconds in the 330' can be caused by anything. Wind, heat, engine temp, whatever.

When you couple test equipment to the engine, and screw with the pink wire, there is no change in ignition timing (except in the under 5MPH area), PERIOD! Believe what you want, but me thinks if you dumped another $130 on a DG3, you want to make yourself believe it's better.......

 

You can say what you want to about the modules. I just wanted to prove that you could buy and install the DG3 and degree key a lot less than the CDI will cost. If I hadnt spoke up everyone would think you were right.

I like the reverse rev limiter. We do have a button to over come it if you want to.
If mine ever went into limp mode because of a loose belt I would want to know about it.
Who ever really sees higher than 7000 on the trails? I dont that much. Its always a race to the next curve where you have to slow down.

Besides that, with my original DG hole shot module and nyroc with the proto type china cdi ran neck and neck several times at 350'. He can verify this if needed. So, there you go, real world test, real world results. The value just isnt there. Dont give me the, "well that cdi was only 32 instead of 33 degree advance either". One degree isnt going to make any difference in the outcome of those drag races we had.

You guys go ahead and buy your China cdi and I will do mine the old way and have fun doing it and taking pride in my work.

BTW, my degree key is in and working excellent. Before I couldnt pull a strong wheelie going 5mph, now I can pull the wheels off the ground around 3' and carry them for 15-20 yards.

 

I don't disagree with you. If you have the tools and the skill, the degree key is easy and cheap power. But, if you don't, then a plug and play CDI comes in as a more "do-it-yourself" friendly task.

I find the reverse limiter a problem for mud. It's impossible to walk it out in reverse when your standing beside the machine. As for the limp mode, you get a huge pile of warning signs before the limp mode occurs. Slipping belts, having it slap the case, etc.

Since it's CVT, the engine spends a lot of time rev'ing pretty high (5000+ RPM), unless your at steady-state cruise. The idea of the CVT is to keep the engine in an optimum power band, and let the tranny take care of the speed changes. When you pin the throttle, the RPM spikes straight up, and then has a gentle climp to red line.

The only real time the CDI has an advantage is past 5500 RPM. The stock CDI is starting to retard the timing, whereas the aftermarket will keep the timing constant. But then, you only really notice it when working for top speed and serious dragging. For those that live in the "normal" real world, it's not really necessary. It's like having a 500HP Viper. Really, do you need that much power? Sure having your face distort from the acceleration would be a blast, but I kind of doubt you spend the whole day gunning it, braking and gunning it again...... [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]


One final comment. Time trials and racing to compare mods is a touchy subject with quads. Fuel and the driver make up for about 20% of the entire machine weight (machine weighs about 700 lbs, fuel and rider about 200lbs). So, take 2 identical machines, one stock, little fuel and a light guy, and the other hopped up, full of fuel and a heavy guy, and the stock machine has a good chance of winning. It's all about power to weight ratio, and 6 gallons of gas is heavy and so is the rider. It's different when you have a 3000lb car at the strip. Driver's weight has much less of an impact.

 

The prices on all of those have been mentioned on here before plenty of times, in enough threads to make this a proverbial dead horse. When you include the cost of install, OR the complete cost of tools and parts to do the install, he IS right. It's only as cheap as you made it out to be if you have access to the flywheel puller, and are doing the install yourself. IF both of those are the case, the degree key + module install is cheaper like you said. I think people understand that now, and probably understood it the last several times its been brought up as well [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]


Brad

 

This is the first time I have seen the Degree key install broken down into price per part. Other words, I have never seen it posted by someone else in here or any other forum.

I did borrow the puller from dealer. That saved me some money. Im not even sure what they cost.

If my cdi showed enough power gains and didnt kickback I would have kept it. I didnt get the wheelie I mentioned in my last post with the cdi. I did gain 2mph on top end though.

This is the last I will try to mention about this.

Have a good weekend everyone. Talk with you on Monday or Tuesday.

 

Howdy. I haven't been on this board for over a year now and my old username (aj650) is lost to a no longer existant email address. My only claim to fame was instructions for an in-frame winch install on the prairie. The tone of the posts seems to have changed a bit. I haven't seen this much hate since my brother caught me with his girlfriend. But hell, I figure she's my cousin too...

Anyway is all this really over a 2mph top end boost and a little more grunt on the bottom? Back when the cdi's were always just a month away (or maybe thanksgiving, hehehe) and the modules were just hitting the market, we believed the CDI was going to be an amazing improvement, but the numbers just don't show that they're what we hoped for. I'd still like to see some actual dyno runs rather than times and seat of the pants. This is just because I can work with raw numbers, but drags can be flawed and seat of the pants can be felt by changing paint color if you really want it. Personally I'd go with the CDI, just because I'm lazy and no longer have the time to do the work I used to, so I don't feel like installing the key. And I guess 2mph on the top will finally have me inching out my buddy on his ds650.

BTW wires, your chart isn't in the right order. Penland was selling the keys well before the modules were out. He's a nice guy, talked me out of buying one from him back in the day. Said I woulnd't see what I wanted unless I had done some top end work. Hard not to trust a guy who'll do that rather than get the quick buck and walk away.

 

Howdy,
the quote, "So no matter which module you buy or how the manufacturer does it, you'll get the same performance" is anything but true. I dont give a dang what your little meters say. I have seen the difference between a Holeshot and a DG3. In 300' the difference was considerable day light between the quads. Before the module change, they were dead even. Now your little meter may say they are the same but if it did I would trade it for a six pack and think that I came out ahead on the trade. Kiss of Death is mechanically able to change his key. It probably is not a big deal for him. He went with the cdi and was not happy with the results. He is now pleased with his module and key. I am in the same ball park with him, 2 mph on the top end doesnt mean anything to me. Unless you are on a drag strip or smooth road, you probably cant open the quad up to see that 2mph. Have a goodun!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Ok, you must have a "magical" CDI that's different than the rest of the world. The one I have, and everyone else has can't be fooled into giving high end power. When you monitor the timing advance, and work it through the power band, and the timing doesn't advance faster, then you CANNOT expect more power.

The first post in this thread:
"STOCK ( DG-3 )

60'....................... 2.088 seconds ( 2nd best time )
330'..................... 6.575 seconds ( 2nd best time )
1/8 mile time ........10.818seconds ( 2nd best time )
1/8 mile speed...... 55.59 mph
1/4 mile top speed .60.05 mph

STOCK ( DGR Hole Shot )

60'....................... 2.0595 seconds ( best time )
330'..................... 6.505 seconds ( best time )
1/8 mile time ........10.6895 seconds ( best time )
1/8 mile speed...... 56.385 mph ( 3rd best speed )
1/4 mile top speed .60.53 mph ( 2nd best speed )
"

Shows the DG3 being 0.07 second SLOWER than a standard DG holeshot. 0.07 seconds is mere test error. That supports my facts, and my testing. Both will give the same result regardless if they are multi-step, single frequency or whatever.

Don't hate the messenger, facts are facts.

 

In all fairness to everyone here, the last quoted times were done on the "stock" quad, with out a wheelie bar... I'm making up a wheelie bar for the stock prairie trailer hitch, so that any future tests with the stock quad, will be WOT from the light, rather than having to feather the gas to control the wheelies, like the runs made with the modded quad...