Dextreme, it's not my post that you question, but I feel what Chucky is refering to is adding 104 to pump gas to obtain a higher octane rating. Adding 104 to avgas that is already rated at 100 or over wouldn't help much.

If you're having trouble with dirty gas the first thing I would do is start buying gas from another manufacturer. May take some research though as 1 manufacturer or distributer may cover many brands and retailers. If the fuel isn't right to begin with all the additives in the world may not help.

 

What is that stuff that Alltoys uses in his machine that actually adds power? Nitrous propane or something like that. I know it wasn't nitro methane. He basically just pours it in the tank, no negative side effects. I don't remember if it required rejetting.

He said it added some power, not lots, but was a good cheap power maker that required no engine mods.

I'm just waitin for ther CDI, and after that I will replace the cams. I probably won't mess beyond that (no turbo, no nitrous, no EFI).

 

Klotz has two power additives for gas: Nitro (50% Nitropropane) and COXOC. I believe nitromethane only mixes with methanol. (see link)

Klotz Gas Additives

 

I have ran Klotz Nitro in various bikes. It mixes with pump, race, and alky. It does help power but not a lot. You will need to up the jet size. It did increase torque.

 

I've no idea what Alltoys uses but , nitro methane is a liquid that I buy by the gallon to make my own model aircraft fuel. I mix it with castor oil, alky, or synthetic oils, to produce fuel for glow engines. It is a product that can be added to alky or gas for a power boost due to it's burning efficiency and volatility.

NOS, nitrous oxide, or laughing gas is injected from a pressurized tank directly into the cylinders in addition to the normal but usually rich mixture.

Sorry, but this is a kind of long story short explaination of the 2 mentioned compounds. Unless you have Alltoys, or some others experience with this stuff, you may cause more harm than good without thier aid. Good pump gas should suffice for the rest of us until the new cdi module is available.

 

We use Klotz Nitro (nitropropane) as Dextreme described above in our pulling bikes, but we don't put it directly in the gas tank.

We use dail-a-jets and a seperate fuel blatter to inject the mixture into the mouth of carbs in the airbox. the dial-a-jets work well in atomizing the the nitro and gas mixture and you can adjust the amount you put in.

klotz recommends not leaving it in the tanks overnight, another reason for having a seperate tank.

I believe Klotz claims a 5% increase in power, about the same as adding a good pipe, but with the dial-a-jets the increase is more, extra fuel and oxy.

I have heard stories of bikes pulling on AVgas, that had problems with vapor locking, not sure if that is in fact true.

I read these posts, and I'm amazed at the knowledge of the people, you guys should be scientist.

nyroc, Dangerous, or AlkyburningX or anyone, we thinking about going to Alky, how sensitive is alky to changes in climate.

 

How sensitive is methanol to climate changes? Well, I feel a 10 degree temp or 10% humidity difference requires different jetting. I play hell in spring and fall here in MO when running alky. In the morning it could be running good because it was jetting perfect for the night before. If I am riding midday or afternoon, I need to change jets. Humidity (which fluctuates all day long in spring/fall here) plays more havoc on alky than temp.

Once you get the alky setup to run right, all the headaches it causes are worth the extra power. I notice HUGE torque increases with 4-strokes on alky. You will burn twice as much as gas, so expect twice the ring wash. Look for a thread titled "running methanol?" over in the performance forum. It was started by gaff. I wrote all the pros/cons I know about alky.

 

Good Day Fellas,

Before I get into fuels lets talk compression as compression dictates what kind of fuel to use and elevation has a large role as well. With the stock Kawi a mid grade gas is more than adiquate to operater the bike 99% of the time any more is a waiste. The motor will only allow so much fuel air mixture to enter unless it is forced in with a turbo for instance. The size of the valves, intake and size of carbs limit the fuel to entering the motor. So now how do we get more fuel into the engine; 1 is to increase size of jets, 2 is to increase air almost 1 1/2 times as much fuel and this rate goes higher as rpm increases. Becasue of our elustrious CDI unit the timeing retards dramatically as rpm increases so we do not need the extra octane for predetunation. If anything it can actually be a detrement as the fuel will explode before it's supposed to causing predetonation which is not good. If you must add octane booster add it to regular gas with some transmission oil rather than adding it to premium gas. Premium plus is over kill you will not see an improvement and I have documemtation to verify this approach.

With the dial a jets they mix the fuel with air producing a full range of oxidised fuel this is great as the mixture while being sucked into the carbs is already mixed combined with an already greater amount of air produce a super slurry of power. Higher octane will not produce the same amount of power as the dial a jets on regular fuel guarnteed. Basically, more compression = more octane, less compression more fuel = less octane more power. EG, you can have a 2 litre engine producing 500hp running on alcohol and nitrous or a 7 litre engine running on regular producing the same hp.

Shotgun uses his dial a jets with a separate fuel sourse although his method is to use Klotz nitro propane which produces more oxygen while added to fuel. I have injected pure oxygen into the motor from an oxygen tank in my shop and all I can tell you is this is like nitrous so it really makes the quad get up and sit at attention. I also think Shotgun advances his timeing to compensate for the added increased fuel air mixture keeping it from predetonation. On a hard pull and the motor starts to knock and it wont be long before the motor is toast just my guess.

Now what I have done to my quad is bored the carbs to 7mms larger, ported polish, blue printed the carbs to speck. The result is they work so smooth the throttle is instantaneous and the power is immediate. I also have the dial a jets like Shotgun and can be worked to use an alternate fuel source or return back to the carbs enabling me to do any sort of combination for turbo installation, or nitrous boost install. From the turn of the dial on the jets I can utlilize any combo I want and not have to pull the carbs apart to achieve it. There are 2 types of Nitrous on the market 1) Dry system 2) Wet system the dry system uses no added fuel to inject into the intake of the motor between carbs and motor this is the one I use as it delivers more HP but at a dangerous price. Next the wet system mixes nitrous with fuel producing less power but more friendly to manage. So far before I had a minor mishap with nitrous and turbo the motor put out a whopping 96.2 HP on the Dyno. Mastrblastr has expressed his willingness to take the Green Machine for a blast next year when we meet. My knuckles are still white from my little experience.

We are still limited by our CDI so really there is no point in going nuts on the higher octane at least that's what I have found you may have other experiences proving otherwise. If you talk to Roscoe69 he has ridden my quad and can tell you what is like and I use regular with octane booster and automatic transmission oil. I am long winded tonight excuse me fellas take care above all have fun.