From my first meeting seven years ago right up to what you witness above....these arrogant (and as you can now see with this 'I will never reveal who we are' MMRC) NAMELESS 'leaders' have used the same tactics over and over again.

First they try and pat you on the head with a wink; chuckling over how much you don't "understand" or how you must get "educated"...and when that doesn't work (you're still asking who the man is behind that curtain)...they bring their single-track buddies in to paint you out as the worst thing to hit this sport in decades.

About all I can say is read the bill, folks and then ask yourself...what's the next piece of legislation going to look like....and why won't you have a say in it? (pretty tough to "get involved" if the very people making decisions for you won't even reveal who they are or what they are doing right in the middle of the most important period in our system's history...not to mention enduring the attacks on your character for even so much as attempting same in the first place).

If the off-hand demise of this bill doesn't convince the Michigan atv community that our "leadership" is not only anonymous, but flat-out weighted against us by these two-wheeled agenda seekers?....I don't know what will.

 

If the off-hand demise of this bill doesn't convince the Michigan atv community that our "leadership" is not only anonymous, but flat-out weighted against us by these two-wheeled agenda seekers?....I don't know what will.


I've been sitting back watching this arguement for sometime now and have to say I've been quite entertained. I also didn't pipe in until now because I didn't want to have a target painted on my back by Blackballed because for the majority of my 36 years of my riding in the woods it's been on a motorcycle.

So, for those of you who don't know me, and because it's my first post here I will give you my name and background.

I am RJ Witte I am a 42 year old Registered Nurse, who works in a Pediatric Intensive Care Unit in Mid Michigan. I am a father of two adult daughters, and a husband to the same woman for 23 years. As stated before I have been riding for 36 years, why on a motorcycle? Because ATV's were not invented until the 1970's and were only for sale in Japan at the time.

I belong to 3 Off Road Organizations, The Valley Trail Riders for 18 years, helped form and organize the Great Lakes Dual Sporters, and most recently became a member of the Board of Governors for the Cycle Conservation Club of Michigan. I have maintained the Gladwin Trail for the past 10 years through two different clubs because it is in my backyard, and am in up to my chin in fighting to get the north loops reopened. I also write a monthly health article for the Great Lakes Trail Rider.

For all of this activity I collect $0.00 I have given it to you, some of you I don't even know, and very few of you I don't even want to know, that is beside the point.

With that said I have paid and continue to pay my dues to the ORV community and am still willing to do what it takes to keep us riding in the woods. Have I always agreed with Busyrider / Dick .. No.. If anybody reading this was around the Ice Racing scene in the Mid 80's in Michigan they would know Dick and I beat heads a few times on racing issues. Some as far back as 5 years ago. We might not have always agreed but in the end we came to solution to work things out.

Blackballeds comment about 2 wheeled leadership working together is really off base. Busyrider has no say or input into the workings of the CCC, he has the same rights and privilages as any other member of the CCC but does not lead us. We share information with him and the D-14 and they in turn share information with us. Most recently we are divided on the new SB847. The CCC has taken a position of "Non Support" on the Senate Bill. This doesn't mean we are against it, nor does it mean we are for it. It means we don't support it. The reason why is some language in the SB goes against the CCC Constitution and Mission. Does sharing the information make us part of a top secret organization? No... it makes us responsible stewarts of the trail.

This will get Blackballed sights pointed at me for sure, but...
I sat in on those original meetings when the trail closures were happening. This trail system was never designed to be a "multi-use" trail system. It was designed for both motorcycles and ATV's, The "routes were designed for "Multi Use" vehicles. It was a hard fought battle to get those, and the "2 wheeled" guys did most of the fighting. Your machine of choice is not even listed by Yamaha as an ATV, It is a Utility Vehicle, you know as in Sport Ultility Vehicle with out the Sport part, Your vehicle belongs on the "Routes" where the trail was designed for those types of machines.

In closing I applaud Blackballed efforts to get his point across, I feel however he is pointing his gun in the wrong direction and should be using his efforts to get the forest roads opened to his type of machine choice. With that said, let the name calling and character assassination begin....

 

Mr. M4Life or " Little Willie',
I knew as I stated that you could not let it go without having the last word because this is a typical sign of a "PHYCHO". You need to express yourself without using swear words when your dandriff is up because that really is a No No on any thread. Maybe YOU are exempt. " ROBERTO DURAND", My goodness, are your claiming now to be a Puerto Rican? ***Edited by ATV Connection Forum Moderator***

 

PHYCHO?

Now thats FUNNY! [lol]

 

***Edited by ATV Connection Forum Moderator***

HAPPY HOLIDAYS

 

Gentlemen, stay on the topic at hand or this thread will become part of the archives. Take your personal problems with each other off the forum.

Dan-ATV Connection Forum Moderator

 

SIR,
I will do that and I hope that you will Reprimand M4life to do the same because I can almost guarentee you he will have the last word again regardless of what you have said here because he is true to form and cannot stop without having the last word bar nothing and be able to go to sleep. When he does, you should ban him period for his disregard to your request. Let's see how you handle this with all due respect... Happy Holiday's to you and all...

 

Superman1, I think you need to worry about yourself and not how others are treated. You control your own destiny.

Dan-ATV Connection Forum Moderator

 

Before I reply to the next segment of our orv advisory board chairman's original post regarding the state-of-the-orv-union here in Michigan; I'd like to say something as the (now) "biggest liability to this sport in decades".

When the orv community is talked down to; patted on the head with a wink and met with rude replies as to who the people are who represent them and what they are doing...it is very interesting how "we" are accused of somehow ruining this sport.
If there is a difference regarding simple acceptable behavior throughout the many varied geographical regions in this state, I do not know....yet I can tell you that many good people have chosen to NOT get involved here for the simple reason that they simply don't LIKE what they see.

Tell me something...how in the heck do you convince somebody that knows how to conduct themselves professionally and who comes from the kind of simple (conservative) background that we LIVE here in much of western Michigan...to travel to "Detroit" or "Lansing" to meet up with these goofs who won 't even tell you who they are or what they are doing!

I mean, let's get real here, folks...every one of these cyclists or red-headed step-child atvers up here.... treat the <U>fact</U> that they meet behind closed doors and anonymously....AS A WAY OF LIFE...ON <U>TRAIL</U> ISSUES, FOR GOSH SAKES!

AND IF YOU DON'T THINK THIS "AFFECTS" THE <U>NUMBER</U> OF AVERAGE ORV USERS HERE IN MICHIGAN DESIRING TO EVEN SO MUCH AS "ASSOCIATE" (LET ALONE PARTNER INFORMALLY) WITH THESE KIND OF "DECISION MAKERS".....YOU DON'T KNOW A DARN THING ABOUT HOW THOSE OF US OUT HERE IN OUR "RURAL" MICHIGAN COMMUNITIES VIEW THE VALUE OF <U>SIMPLE STRAIGHT FORWARDNESS</U>.

The light 4-wheeled community here in Michigan has been forced to deal with not one, but two incarnations of this "pay no attention to the 'men' behind the curtain crap" in its atv leadership for all of the 7 years I've been following them.
While this may be a highly effective way of keeping all but the sturdiest of convicted ETHICAL users out there from getting involved in these people's 'business'....it doesn't do a DARN thing for uniting this community or recruiting anybody in the future to put up with these bozos.
Again, why sit down to dinner or over a beer with all these (quote/unquote) 'leaders' from this 'super-secret' MMRC....when you look around the table and they've all got masks on and 'disclosure' papers in their hands needing to be signed!

If you want this community to get behind you and <U>support</U> what you do...I suggest not treating everybody who comes along questioning why you back up the very people demanding that they pull that curtain around you...like crap (and from the way I've witnessed you defend that same person and refuse to speak to the subject itself....YOU'RE JUST AS GUILTY).

Ran out of time....

John
("the biggest liability in this sport") [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

 

QUOTE ***When the orv community is talked down to; patted on the head with a wink and met with rude replies as to who the people are who represent them and what they are doing
END of QUOTE***

BB,
You've personally been a member of many differant ATV related clubs and NON of the leaders have EVER meet YOUR agenda.You continue to attemtp to TRY and manipulate others into YOUR way of seeing things and quite frankly,you see how far thats got you.

Now since you dont like what you see in these clubs and from the ORV leaders in our sport,I just dont understand WHY you dont form your OWN ATV/ORV club with members that have the same aganda's and direction that you do?You could be the President of this club and have your own ''SECRET MEETING'S'' from within your OWN organization. You could discuss who's bringing the weenie's to the next ATV ride,or better yet,what kind of Logo you guys want on your shirts and hats. And if you had the time,you could even go as far as proclaiming a MARCH to Lansing in PROTEST to the powers that be that YOUR club DEMANDS some answers..-------------------------ALL TWO of YOU!

Seriously,if things are as bad as you portray that they are,perhaps you should concider your own club and getting yourself INVOLVED,YOUR WAY?.