MWQ:
"...The guys who got it all started. Some of them have been riding since before quads were even thought of...."
<B>
&lt;/B&gt;...so this gives them the right to declare 100 miles of "motorcycle only" riding area as "what the riding public truly desires"...while at the same patting themselves on the back as "working together with everybody" while trying to kick <u>anybody</u> to the curb who even so much as 'dares' question overt attempts such as this, not to mention lying about a recent legislation's intent or even closing down trails to build new ones right beside them?

Where does it all stop, MWQ?

 

Come on BBalled.. at some point you have to let it go or it will consume you... You have too many battles left to fight to make this a persoanl vendetta against one or two individuals. Mudslinging isn't working..... you know it and it frustrates the heck out of you. You need a new attack strategy...

That doesn't mean giving up... just that you need a new angle... I always thought that people listen harder when you whisper than when you shout...

You and I are probably too set in our ways to change... but it can be done if you work at it...

 

It definiutely doesnt give them the right, but I would think some one like you would understand that they feel threatened. This isnt a easy problem to fix and I dont have a clue how to solve this and thankfully for me it isnt that big of a deal out here in ca yet. I only hope that you can figure out a new way to get your point across because what your doing now doesnt sem to be working. I wish I could be of more help.

 

What BB is doing now is NOT working,in fact,he has all but closed the eyes of anyone in the entire ORV community that use to listen to anything he had to say in the past.Most DNR personel that know him,cant stand him,the ORV Advisory Board dont want to hear anymore of his rants and raves either,im guessing thats why they shut him down in his last ORV Board meeting.

He even shut down the ears of the only person in the entire State of Michigan that would take the time of day to listen to him and keep an open line of communication thru telephone conversations weekly.That person was ME!

Its just to bad,because HONESTLY,I think he has some great idea's and LEGITIMATE gripes.But his lines of communication leaves little to be desired.

 

It's pretty tough to agree with anybody on the outside of a circle of influence on any issue... if one has already sold their soul to these very same people for things like a closer place to ride (new city slicker riding area) or more subsidized orv sticker money flowing into a "non-profit".
I have always given every person who ever agreed with me on any issue more than one chance to stand up like a man and fight for what they supposedly believed in...yet inevitably, their relationship with these very same people above, coupled with any negative effect said issue might <U>have</U> on any one of their (again) "non-profits".....has been a big 'ol ball-busting deal-breaker each and every instance the time actually came to pick up that sword.

Like good 'ol Mom used to say...if you want to solve a problem and get to who's behind it...."follow the money".

Aint it the truth, [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/img]

 

I hope your not attemting to tell the veiwers of this audience that ''I'' sold my soul to ANYBODY in the name of non-profit.If so,we could add that statement to the vast amount of poor information that you've brought forward in many forums.Im not polising my own star,but not many [if any] in the entire State of Michigan has supported the sport of ORVing any more than I have since 2000 in this State.Sometimes you have to GIVE a little,and at times,you have to be real stern about some issues.YOU---dont understand the DIFFERANCE.

Is it me,or does it look like the few supporters you had in here,left you too!

 

Im still here! [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

 

 

[quote]
Originally posted by: BusyRider
"...(now) Let me hit on some of this "distant from the truth stuff"..."

Since our long departed advisory board chairman has already ducked out of this conversation before it was finished....please allow me to illustrate why he did so:

".. ORV Advisory Board is just that, an Advisory Board. Has no power, zero, is appointed by the DNR....."

No power? ...Hmmm, how does supposedly being the primary CITIZEN'S advisory vehicle for hundred's of thousands of enthusiasts in this state...the people they are told to go <u>to</u> with their primary needs and wants....cause you to somehow DOWNPLAY even the very position itself? And as far as being "appointed by the DNR"...how could you believe that the first obstacle you would have to obviously overcome...is the possible perception within this community that you are not just another talking head flunky for these same people? Again, how could you possibly think that popping your head out from behind that curtain every 3 or 6 months with "we have no power" (<u>but this is the way its going to be, by gosh!!!</u>)...would ever endear you to anybody...let alone cause them to believe any kind of monitored accountability is taking place?

"...Serves as a means for us as users groups to convey our message to the DNR...."

When you stand up there as 'big cheese' at these advisory board meetings claiming that we just have to form a multi-user group council to accomplish the above....then angrily claim many months later that that this same council has "nothing to say" about the very update plan <u>YOUR</u> "OTHER" ADVISORY BOARD CAN'T EVEN PUBLISH A PUBLIC POSITION ON" (as they are charged to do in the very outline of their responsibilities)...why pray tell would this public believe they are properly represented regarding <u>anything</u>??? (especially when this community is rudely rebuked for so much as "daring" to ask who these people are or even what they believe in....let alone being <u>forced</u> to ridiculously argue for years about simple contact information that your counterpart board glady provides in the light of day?).
I mean, c'mon Dick!!! When I go to my representative on your council with simple questions such as the ones above...why would you think we view you as anything but arrogant ***** when said 'representative' flat out refuses to respond after <u>repeated</u> requests to do so....forcing the DNR to inform us that they know not a damn thing....about any of you!

Sorry folks, I've again run out of time and am sorry that each ridiculous statement here takes so much reading effort on your part. Hopefully you understand that this is the first time these people have come out and allowed any of their nonsense to be displayed/debated in public and I think it is a darn good exercise into how these AMA "legislative directors" play ball. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

 

By the way, kidding around acknowledged....but this is the hand I've been dealt while attempting to simply fight for the public's right to be involved in the disposition of their resource. In Muddy's defense, he's the only one of about 3 of 'em in this Michigan 'atv' community who will even come out of their non-profit holes in the ground...yet I'd be hard-pressed to come up with a more profound illustration of what I've been 'up against' to date.