If I offend anyone with my opinions on this situation I apologize.

Hmmm should we all suffer for one person's stupidity!!??? The area near me that is a designated ORV riding area open all year is now closed from One stupid individual.

Im not fond of a scrambler myself, But I have respect for the machines power, and handling abitlities. BUT!!! I seen a fatal flaw with the automatic. And it's not the machine's fault. And or Polaris. Its the Riders fault, And the parents who allow this...

Me and a friend out riding. Witnessed a 5 year old kid barely siting on a scrambler. his feet could not touch the pegs.
No Helmet. I did mention my disapproval with the parents, ANd i got called some nasty names because of it.
That kid is now in the hospital in a coma with mass head injury! The child got scared grabbed the handlbars. Along with the throttle! The poor child launched into the woods full throttle. Need I say more.
My prayers go out to this family and this child. I pray somebody reads this and they realize a child that age SHOULD NEVER be on a machine unattend that powerful, without proper gear..
And Right now I have some choice words for those parents that i can't mention here.

 

3cross,

Those are exactly the kind of people that ended up getting rid of both 3-wheelers and the TRX250R. know why, they don't want to take responsibility of their actions, so they go and sue the manufacture. And on top of that a jury is conned into thinking that its the machines and/or the manufactures' falt.

For example, a friend of mine said that his neghbors put thier 8 year old, again no helmet, on a '84 250R 3-wheeler and let him go in the field. Guess what he died that day, and the parents sue Honda and WIN $3 million dollars. How is that even justified! Its unfortunate, but I'm sorry they killed their child, not Honda.

Basically, that's the same as putting an 8 year old in a car, giving him, or her a broom stick to push the pedals with. You think that would hold up in court, I don't think so.

In 1989 Honda paid over $2 billion in lawsuits for mainly people like these. So if your wondering why there is no longer a 250R, well theirs the answer. Everybody should do as you did 3cross and tell anybody riding without the proper gear that they should use it. Just like many people, I wish I could go to the dealer and buy a new 250R, and we have these ignorant soles to thank for not being able to do so.

But why do they still make racing bikes you may ask, well as the same friend pointed out to me once, people listened to Barbra Walters, and bike riders don't sue. I'm not saying ATVers sue, not the enthusiests any way, but ATV's are something almost anybody can ride. So there are those who don't care one bit about the sport out there getting themselves hurt and ruining it for the rest of us.

Personally, I would like to have a little chat with Barbra Walters, because I actually remeber seeing a show she did before I even started riding ATV's. It was the same thing, a young kid not wearing a helmet on too big a three wheeler, riding on a big rocky hill. His parents blamed his death on the three wheeler, and Barbra totally agreed. Did she get a point-of-view from somebody actually invoved in the sport, no it was totally one sided... Maybe its time Barbra should appologies to all of use for almost getting rid of our sport! What do you think?

Also, if somebody like Gore is somehow elected President, we better be ready to do even more fighting to keep the sport alive and trails open.

Sickman

 

Interesting, timely posts on this topic, illustrating 1) absence of personal responsibility; and 2) media dominance.

1) Personal responsibility. Do you think, even now, the parents of the comatose child, the parents who were warned of the dangers of allowing the infant to ride the powerful machine without a helmet, think THEY were somehow complicit in their child's accident? I DOUBT IT! Likely their denial system blames Polaris, the extraordinary conditions of the accident, etc., in short, ANYTHING but their own negligence, carelessness, and arrogance for the pathetic result.

2) Media dominance. Ralph Nader's "Unsafe At Any Speed," dooming the Corvair; and the "Consumer Group's" Samurai rollover "tests," kiboshing the Suzuki SUV; and the ATC "demonstrations," where open-throttled riderless 3-wheelers were unleashed cross-country and filmed overturning . . .

The list goes on. Barbara Walters and her ilk, the "talent" on the tube, are merely puppets, trained to read the teleprompter loaded by their producers (without any understanding of the content of significance therein).

The media moguls will blame an inanimate object, like an ATV or, for example, a firearm, for any manner of evil and misuse. Meanwhile, they snicker, nudge and wink about "recreational drug" and "substance abuse" "problems" encountered by their sports/entertainment favorites . . .

SOLUTION. Playing the game of "Ain't It Awful," merely whining about the existence of a problem without suggesting a solution seems in itself irresponsible. While I have no solution, I can only say, one should do what one can along the lines of effectiveness. For example, suggesting to parents allowing an infant to pilot a Polaris without a helmet might be a bad idea is about all that could be done; certainly, the poster must feel better about himself for warning the parents, instead of turning a blind eye prior to the accident.

When suggesting safe practices, expect defensive reactions; deflection of blame and guilt. However, even though individuals may protest, they may modify their behavior in the future.

Tree Farmer

 

Thank you for the reply.
But, unfortunatly the parents are blaming Polaris, As well as the owner of the land were the incident took place.

I bellieve their own ignorance is to blame.
Because of their ignorance at the child's expense we lose a riding area, Yet the parents walk away with no blame and Deep pockets from lawsuit.

To where and or when has society lost responsibilities for one's actions and or choices.

I also agree with you both on the situations with BARB mentioned above. She can critize nicely when there is nobody to debate against.

 

I cover ATV Safety for a group of Hunter's Education Instructors here in South Arkansas and also am an ASI Instructor. One of the demos I do for all my classes is hold up a .357 S&W revolver and ask the adults how many of them would load it up and give it to there child and tell them to go out and play with it alone. Of course none say they would. I then ask the children how many of them would take it out of the gun cabinet and load it up and go out and play with it alone. Again, I've never had any who said they would. I then tell them that it can't kill any quicker or any deader than an ATV can. My 14 year old son can shoot that .357 better than I can. Because I've taken him out and taught him to safely handle it while making sure he's wearing the proper protection while shooting. He still doesn't get to take it out alone, even with all this. Why should the ATV be different? I take my son riding just as I take him shooting. I love my son and it's my responsibility as a parent to protect him and teach him as he grows to be a man. That's in the job description for us parents. I usually end up telling my classes that before now they maybe had an excuse - they didn't know any better. From this point on, if their child is alone riding an ATV without a helmet and is injured or killed it will be THEIR fault and my words will haunt them for the rest of their lives. Has it changed anyone's attitudes? I don't know, I would like to think so. A lot ignore me I am sure, but if only one person now gets out with their child instead of sending them out to play on the ATV alone or only one parent now insists on helmet usage, I might have saved a life. Just those "maybes" makes it worth the time I have spent and will continue to spend.

 

This is just another case of a moron set of parents. Period. The same deal as in those Columbine High School shootings...the parents "not knowing" their sons were troubled. Hogwash!

You know, the more I walk through life I'm convinced that certain people should be prohibited from reproducing.

I had to laugh....talk about "news" reporting..I'm taking my ATV out one Saturday morning and I had the news on the radio. Local news that is (yikes). Here was the broadcast more or less:

"A seven year old child from Imperial (a town) was killed yesterday when she was thrown from the all terrain vehicle on which she was a passenger" What I found out later was that the ATV was being driven by the child's mother's "boyfriend" who was (1) drunk, as well as (2) wearing no helmet. Needless to say, neither was the poor little girl.

Now, this is nothing but sheer stupidity. The mother should have known better as should have the "boyfriend." Reading about people like this makes me sick!

 

Ahh Imperial! Yes i know the case.
And your absolutely correct on the condition of the mother. She was trashed. They did admit it in the local paper because she was charged with a DUI. But the press don't want to admit those facts.

 

3cross,

Based on what you have said, you have an obligation to help the defense in the lawsuit. Find out who the defense attorney is and tell them your story.

It may not help them succesfully defend the suit, but you'll have done everything that you can to defend your sport.

If more people get involved on the side of what is right, we can make a difference. We talk about personal responsibility when it comes to riding ATVs, how about when it comes to someone trying to harm the sport?

------------------
Kevin Staton
Y2K Polaris Magnum 325 4x4
<a href="www.korrnet.org/watvclub">Windrock ATV Club</a>

 

To anyone who doubts the existence of a "tort liability crisis", please inform those of us who are forced to carry millions of dollars of liability coverage (both personal and business), exactly what you mean. I have never in my life been sued, nor my business and partners. Likewise many of those I am acquainted with in the Chamber of Commerce in my area as well as various civic and business organizations. Yet all of us are paying thousands of dollars a year for premiums. Now you may say "See, that proves the insurance companies want everyone to believe their is a crisis.", so they can charge for the premiums. Just one problem though, I said "many" of those I know have never been sued. The few unfortunate ones who have been more than make up for the others. Now mind you, most of the ones I am familiar with, the actual business or person whose policy and personal/business wealth were drained had very little to do with the so called negligence or mishap. They were simply one of about 10-20 defendants named in a civil action, and were totally SHOCKED to find out the business they worked at building was now the target of a lawsuit.

It comes down to one thing, the law allows for suits to be filed, yes smart attorneys will only take cases they are sure they can win, but the way in which the system metes out justice is criminal, and the laws must be changed.

The few suits that do go to trial (less than 10%) have large enough an impact to cost the public 1000's of times their cost in fees encountered by businesses to cover insurance and protective costs.

While most suits do not go to trial, due to companies following advice of attorneys and bad publicity, many (not sure of exact % but I believe it is somewhere around additional 10-25%), are settled out of court at additional costs to businesses and their insurance companies.

I think it is appropriate to remember at this point that these so called "evil" companies, like GM, IBM, Polaris...any company, must factor these expenses into the cost of their products and services, which they then pass along to guess who?

While these folks involved in these horrific accidents will pay their whole lives for their poor discernment, I personally do not believe the rest of us should have to pay for it out of our pockets, which we ultimately do. The system is transferring wealth at an all time high into the hands of an ever increasing minority(read trial lawyers, not all, but some), and it is not by productivity or ingenuity, but by duplicity backed by the legal system.

P.S. My attorney and I have discussed this and HE is the one who said if we don't like it we should change the laws. How's that for in your face!



------------------
Mike...99 Scrambler 400, 94 Kawasaki Bayou 400(newly rebuilt), 99 Impuls 50(Matt's)

 

Mike,open the yellow pages and look how many lawyers are listed there...
They all need to make living,don't they.
There's 70% of worlds lawyers living in the USA.
Maybe too many lawyers = too many laws or better yet, too many lawsuits.
Wouldn't that be logic?
If a stupid women spills a cofee in her
lap, someone takes that idiotic case,
and sue the McDonalds company. Who is it.A priest?? No, a lawyer smeling the money,big money,maybe..Only in America this case goes to the court and only in America the case ended up as it did.....
If I had 5 speed tickets in 1 year and had an attorney with me at the court every time, I would have clean record and no conviction.
Lawyers loyalty??

How much money has a top government lawyer made on Tobacco companies. About 3{?!} billions....
And you saying , that the lawyers are not the problem. You may be right,maybe the number is a problem...maybe the immoral ones..

Joe